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Vitalis
April 2nd, 2008, 09:22 PM
I've noticed that there aren't many shotgun threads here yet, so I've started one.

I own a Remington 870 and think it's a good all-purpose shotgun, I'm just wondering what everyone else thinks about it and if they've made any useful modifications to theirs.

BlackFalcoN
April 2nd, 2008, 10:18 PM
They are nice guns and have been a long-time favourite by police in the USA I believe, probably with good reason.

When it comes to pump action shotguns, I think a lot depends on personal preference, since they all basicly have to do the same thing: release a projectile that is not very aerodynamically to start from through a relatively short, unrifled barrel.

Extreme precision is not a possible with a shotgun due to it's design concept. Yet within a range of 15 meters, there is nothing that beats the lethality of a good 12 gauge loaded with buckshot. (Maybe except for a Class 3 machine gun, but good luck getting one of those :rolleyes: )

I prefer the Mossberg 500/590 series myself.

They are overall substantially cheaper than the Remingtons, yet they perform as well (or even better) than the Remington 870. (according to others, since I never owned a 870)
Like the 870, they also have multiple barrel length options and are available in different finishes.
The Mossberg 500 is also the only pump action that passed the US Army's Mil-Spec 3443E test. (reliability test under extreme conditions).
There are also a bit more after-market accessories available for the Mossberg 500/590 I think. (but that's not a very decisive argument, since most after market parts are not essential, and most essentials are available to a 870 as well )

As for modifications to a shotgun:
I personally like the Tac Star side saddle that allows to carry 6 rounds extra on the receiver; very conveniently to quickly change a buckshot load for a slug load when not having the time to go trough your pockets to look for one.

Also, having ammunition on the gun makes you not have to look for ammo when a home invader wakes you up at 4 o'clock in the morning, since the ammo is already there.

I also like the heat shield to mount on the barrel. There is little tactical advantage to be gained from this, except that you can't easily burn your fingers anymore on a hot barrel. Plus they look good on the shotgun too :cool:

A simple sling, allows you to dismount the gun and still carry it while you perform other actions with your 2 hands. No need to go �ber fancy there, heck even a piece of solid rope could basicly perform that function.

I can see a certain advantage in having a tactical light mounted on the gun, since a shotgun really is a dedicated 2 handed weapon to be effective, and you don't have a spare hand as with a pistol to hold a flashlight. In defensive situations, you want to be able to light a target before you make a shot. A 500$ Sure-fire offers only marginally more tactical effectiveness than a clamp mounted 20$ Mini Maglite I think, yet costs 25 times as much. Better invest in a spare set of rechargeable batteries instead :p

Personally I would never consider putting a pistol grip on a shotgun, except maybe only for dedicated breaching applications, where a limited amount of shots has to be made and the shotgun fills a support role.

A fixed solid stock provides better recoil management and aiming (especially for firing slugs).

Remember that a fixed stock can always be converted to a pistol grip in a truly SHTF situation.(it just takes 3 minutes for Mr Hacksaw blade to achieve the desired result:D)

Also, for the Remington 870,Mossberg 590 and others, there exist magazine tube extensions, which will increase your magazine capacity (which is a bit of a negative on a Mossberg 500, since it's design won't allow for an extension :( ).

Lastly I would consider putting ghost rings on any shotgun, since an ordinary bead site is really only suitable for CQB with (buck)shot.

If you want to make longer shots with slugs or sabots, you truly need a better means of aiming the gun than the plain bead site. A slug penetrating a mini-van at 50 meters is nice to have, but really useless if you were originally aiming for the guy standing 10 meters to the left of it.

Any gun is only as good as it is aimed, and when shooting rifled slugs, you really need something better than beads.

That's just my oppinion on how a basic "tactical" pump action shotgun should look like, I'm sure others will disagree :p

phrankinsteyn
April 3rd, 2008, 01:03 AM
BlackFalcoN,

I think you pretty well covered it concerning the Mossberg. As you posted, the magazine tube extension is the only problem/flaw I have with this shotgun (but I still own two of them). I favor a shotgun, for self defense, (I have poor eye sight :() and like a grenade, you don't need pin point accuracy to be effective (if using 00 or 000 buckshot).

Vitalis
April 3rd, 2008, 01:29 AM
Yea, I've heard some people say they prefer the Mossberg over the Remington, but I know someone who shoots a lot and they said to go with the Remington.

Nothing beats a shotgun with some 00 or 000 buck for close range defense.

I've got to look into the magazine tube extensions, that sounds like a good idea. I've already got a butt stock shell holder so I have extra shells at my disposal, but the higher capacity, the better.

Charles Owlen Picket
April 3rd, 2008, 10:30 AM
Mossburg 500/590 has a alloy receiver and less overall parts than the Remington; the weight factor making some people feel that the 590 kick a bit more than the 870. But it really the comb that determines that recoil feel. The Remington has a thin, graceful grip and doesn't drop at the steep angle than the 500/590.

The 590A1 won several military contracts surviving a torture test in which one 590A1 digested 25,000 rounds and miked the same after not having any problems. The real military Mossburgs all have alloy trigger guards & safety's (little known tid-bit). 450,000 were made for a contract that was superseded by Benelli getting a share & about 60-80,000 were sold at the public level.

Remington have the largest public-service sales and contracts. One for the US State Dept. was the most lucrative & was the opening of their stealing the "Marine Coat" silver coloured finish FROM Mossburg (little known tid-bit).

Remington's 870 in the hands of the Nation's police number over 500,000. Military contracts were few but existed. Remington bought out Ithica (trench shotgun contract) and had started producing the production runs of the AOW 14" barrels for various entities; a new production of Class III since the Ban (little known tid-bit).

Rbick
April 4th, 2008, 10:16 AM
My father has an old left handed 870 that is over 25 years old. Its beat to hell but it still works just as well as it did the first day he bought it. We actually used it as a paddle when we lost our oar in the marsh one day while hunting. He's always telling me "That gun has shot more ducks than you could ever imagine!". Its a great gun though, and he still uses it.

I've noticed that getting a nice pistol grip stock, folding stock, or telescopic stock, is hard to find unless you have a Mossberg or Remington. I've been searching for a nice stock for my Browning BPS 12 ga. but I can't seem to locate one. I'm planning on purchasing a Mossberg 500 Persuader in the near future. You can find them w/ telescopic stocks for about 300$.

Super Chief
April 19th, 2008, 09:44 PM
Currently I have 5 870s and I gave one to my son as a gift last Christmas. His is an Express Magnum with a cantilever rifled barrel in 12 GA. With sabot slugs and a scope, it's as accurate as most rifles within it's effective range. The gun is meant for deer hunting with that setup. It has the synthetic stocks. An R3 or newer Super Cell recoil pad goes a long way in taming the felt recoil. My 870s are all Wingmasters. The oldest is a 1969 standard and the latest is one of the new Light Contour guns with Rem Choke and chambers 3" shells. I've got an older Magnum that handles the 3" shells as well. The older guns are fixed choke and only the new one has the changable choke tubes. I just mentioned all that to show the variety in 870s. I didn't mention the 3.5" Super Mag. I don't have one of those yet.

As for a great gun, Field & Stream listed the 870 number 2 in it's list of "The 50 Best Shotguns Ever Made" . A Purdey side-by-side was number 1.
http://www.fieldandstream.com/article_gallery.jsp?ID=1000014271&page=2
The 870 has changed little since they started making them in 1950. Mechanically my new 870 is like the one I have from 1969. The only difference is the screw in choke tubes and the new keyed safety.

As for the Mossberg, I was just viewing an AGI video on them. The early pumps had bugs, but the company improved the guns over the years. The newer guns are supposed to be good guns. I'm a Remington fan, so I'd go with an Express for about $300 before getting a Mossberg. My 870 LC costs about $800, but it's a fancy grade. A friend of my son has a Mossberg and he's happy with it.

In the end it pretty much comes down to preference. Remington has the high end Wingmaster for aesthetic values and the Express for utilitarian needs. Mechanically both versions are outstanding. Mossberg makes a good pump, and the lower end is about the same as the 870 Express. Check out Gunbroker.com and GunsAmerica for some good pricing. Did I mention I have a couple of 1100 semi-autos? One is standard and the other is a Duck Magnum. I've got a few other guns in the safe, but no other shotguns ... yet.

Hope that helps. Here's a link for the Mossberg video.
http://torrents.thepiratebay.org/3970641/AGI-_Mossberg_500____s_Armorer_Course.3970641.TPB.torr ent
Check first to see if its listed here on the forum somewhere. I'm a newb and still looking around.