Hi, my first post here, saw this link to a bunch of home made automatic weapons
and thought you all would enjoy. hope it hasn't been posted before. :)

http://englishrussia.com/?p=965

I'm pretty sure a lot of these haven't been "homemade", but a good link, nonetheless. They show some creativity, and there are some strange choices as regards finishes and things that have been engraved and stamped, so I think most of those are either repairs or re-used bits.

I like the Barrett knock-off. :-)

Yeah, I am with Jacks, I see what is clearly a Mosin Nagant in there, and what looks reminiscent of an early model of the AK-47...

Still, interesting to look at... I laughed so hard when I saw the barret... thingy.

I saw a PTRS-41 anti tank cannon on GunBroker.com a while ago. Looked similar, MAN would I like one of those. 16 grand though.

They certainly aren't all homemade, but most of them look to me like they're at least partially improvised.

The revolvers probably weren't homemade. Why make a revolver in your home/guerrilla workshop when it's almost certainly easier to make a submachine gun?

As for the Mosin Nagant, that might be a homemade copy, but it could also be a real Mosin Nagant action with a homemade stock. The barrel might have also been shortened a bit.

Some of those subguns definitely look homemade, although at least a couple of parts were probably scavenged from other (presumably non-functional) guns.

By the way, does anyone know what the picture on the top of that page is supposed to be? My guess is some kind of grenade launcher.

Incidentally, there's another article on guerrilla weapons (but not homemade) here for those who are interested:
http://www.military.com/NewContent/0,13190,Defensewatch_062405_Quigley,00.html

Some of those SMGs looks very simple to build...

My guess is that the fat thing on the top picture was built in that way due to lack of material suitable for conventional barrels. No chrome-moly steel or similar, only what-ever-that-is. Solution? -Build the barrel EXTREMELY thick.

Or is it a grenade launcher? Intriguing, since the barrel looks quite short for most grenade calibers, even 20mm.

I bet it would lob a hand grenade quite a long way with a small BP charge, though.

It is more likely your first idea, though, of "let's make this really thick because that's all I've got handy, and I like my fingers"!

These are nice improvised "firearms", especially when you look at the conditions in which they are manufactured, not to mention the quality of materials.

Wonder how long they keep working? A long-term test for "scrapmetal weapons"?

That's the way, though, isn't it? If you can make yourself a quiet single shot gun, you can use it to get yourself another one that isn't so quiet, and has far more than one shot.

Actually, I've been thinking about this, and any design like this needs to have 2 shots, and be silenced. Then it either needs to be long range, or small for close work. Shotgun style is probably best for the shorter range deals.

Looking at the MO of the police, etc. they tend to go about in twos, with others nearby. Hence, take down two quickly and quietly, and you have two MP5's, Glocks, etc. plus police radios, handcuffs, batons, CS spray, maybe a Taser, and so on.

Soldiers are harder targets, for obvious reasons. I'll leave that to you to work out.

some of theose look like the "borz" machine pistol.its supposed to be easy to make and maintain.but there isnt much information about it.

Hi, my first post here, saw this link to a bunch of home made automatic weapons
and thought you all would enjoy. hope it hasn't been posted before. :)

http://englishrussia.com/?p=965

Ya these are some really good homemade weapons. I'm likeing the home AK :cool:. I have been looking up on the belt fed guns. I was wondering did you make that. If you did could you post the pictures of the design of the feed. Please that would be so nice. :D I have some books on a few of these designs. I liked them alot. I pretty much have all of Bill Holmes's books and a few of P. A. Luty's books ,luckly I got them before he wanted to have people buy them. ;)

As it is relatively easy to make a gun (as I did back when I was fourteen, proving the futility of gun-control laws. If a teen with a minimal engineering experience and a limited workshop could make a shotgun, anyone could.)

The belt-fed machine gun isn't home-made, of course, it just appears to be a Browning or the like in a state of sacreligious disrepair. The guns that resemble Tec-9s may have been home-made, but most certainly not by the fools who made the patchwork rifles.

Moral of the story? Get some fucking schematics.

I thought I should point out that the Chechen's who were fighting the russians are muslim. That has some bearing I think. :)

At least they bothered to fight!

Who, the russians or the chechens?

The Chechens.

I've a feeling the Brits would sit here and take almost anything. We haven't even argued about this freaking smoking ban, which bans ALL smoking in even partially enclosed spaces, even in a smoking club or tobacconists. That means you can be fined £50 for standing in a bus shelter and smoking!

No major outcry about anything over here, from the cold blood killing of people and framing by police, to billions of pounds made by privatised monopolies, to the thousands of oppressive laws added to the books every week.

If the Russians invaded now, it would only be to send the Poles and Romanians back home, so they could take their jobs!

In deed, they did fight back. Now the whole country (especially the capital, Groznij) looks like hell on earth. (Ruins everywhere, no fortified central goverment, just emerging warlords and the russian deathsquads, bombings, shoot-outs, etc, every day - all over)

This question may be a sidetracker. but I have to ask it. If a same situation would arise (in your country), would you fight back just like them? Even knowing that the fight could last for decades, and turn the country into a shithole (for few generations atleast)?

Fight to live free in a shithole or take it up the ass and be a slave in... well, much less of a shithole?

Absolutely, I would.

Fester, you might want to clarify which of those two options you'd choose.

It made more sense when I was thinking about the original question. :o I should have just quoted it rather than trying to reword it. Guess I was just typing while thinking aloud.

...would you fight back just like them? Even knowing that the fight could last for decades, and turn the country into a shithole (for few generations atleast)?

Absolutely, I would [fight]. It's easier for free men to rebuild than for slaves to emancipate themselves.

I'm curious as to who on the Forum wouldn't fight. Maybe that would be the better question for Hatal to ask.

I thought there would be riots in the streets when they banned smoking in Ohio at the beginning of this year. Blighty may be smoke free without a pep, but Hell, at least you can show naked titties on UK telly. This awsome freedom costs $10 a month in the form of HBO or Showtime in the USA.

If we had more porn in the US perhaps we would not notice our freedoms being taken away as much? I know I wouldn't notice the lack of cigarettes if I was waiting for a nude shot of Billie Piper...

Exactly, fester.

Chechens, even if partly fueled by radical islamist fervor, get my sympathy for standing up against the Russian aggression. As objective and non-overpatriotic asshole as I try to be I can see very little positive sides Soviet/Russian presence especially has brought to its occupied countries. Rather I become more and more thankful for my grandfather's generation to have enough skills and will to hold them off despite the crushing odds, and later fill the country with secret weapon and explosives caches in case of a run through. They did absolutely the right thing even if the price of independence was high. East Europe is not poorer and more crime-ridden than the West for nothing, let alone what it was like during the occupation time. I'm not sure but I believe many of those people, now looking back, would have rather risked their lives protecting their rights than to put up with the shit they got on them for decades ever since. Being submissive and creating a military vacuum are one of the most anti-pacifist things to do. Though todays crisises are more asymmetric and internal the old wisdom Si Vis Pacem Para Bellum still holds. None of us can predict what the world is like after say 20 years, but by being skilled, educated and physically and mentally as strong as possible we'll at least stand a better chance of survival if not prevent violence in the first place. Like fester said, one would think most Forumites probably share the same view on this.

It's only too bad the Chechens weren't provided with better means for defending their homes and families, what's left of them anyways.

Eastern Europe is the same third world shithole as it has always been.
Fascism had changed to Communism and Communism changed to Capitalism. But in Eastern Europe nothing changed.

People here have their own understanding for life and culture. It is not called "The Orient" for nothing. If the time is reversed, the people from the Balkan will do absolutely the same as they did... Give their ass for free to whoever conqueror comes! They gave their ass to the Russians, then to the USA, now the ass slowly turns to China (Interesting to spot that during the CCCP , people in the CCCP lived much worse (no meet, no fuel) than the people in Bulgaria, Romania, Ugoslavia. The russians were coming in Bulgaria to spend their holidays and were just amazed by the living standard)...
Anyway, every good idea in Eastern Europe finally drowns in a sea of corruption...

The one in the middle, that looks reminiscent of an AK, I think is a German Sturmgeweher 44

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Sturmgewehr_44.jpg

Here is a picture of one for comparison. Look at the grip and the butt shape, almost identical. But it has been heavily modified in the barrel and stock area.

I believe it is more likely to be based on a shortened Dragunov sniper rifle with AK47 butt and pistol grip or an AK47 modified to take the larger 7.62mm round of the Dragunov with two magazines welded together.

Here is a link to pictures of the Dragunov
http://world.guns.ru/sniper/sn18-e.htm.
The small tube things with pistol grip and fore grip I would say are probably improvised grenade launchers firing the 30mm grenade from the AGS-17.
One of the revolvers is an old S&W 1881 D/A firing the 44 Russian or at least based on this model, the hammer looks homemade.

I have to say something about this, in my opinion how could you say "Chechens, even if partly fueled by radical islamist fervor, get my sympathy for standing up against the Russian aggression."

The men who are fighting the wars in Chechnya aren't even Chechen, they left after the first war, the only ones that are there now are hired jihadists funded by radical terrorist organizations to "kill the infidels".

Here is what you are sympathizing with: http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=176_1187215494

That is a video recorded by jihadists during the second war.
An islamic group led by Temirbulatov, crossed into a town called Dagestan with about 200 fighters, the village was protected by 13 lightly armed russian conscripts of which 7 ran way and 6 got captured, the captured 6 suffered horrible fates.

If any of you are familiar with ogrish.com then I would not recommend watching this video, its not for weak stomachs, and it is that brutal and revolting.

Why am I posting this video? Why would ANYONE in there right mind want to watch somebody be murdered? This is reality, that's who you sympathize with.

@Shadowmartyr: I still sympathize with them. Tell me when you have the russian special forces on video in Chechnya (you know, the russian death squads "cleaning" the town from civilians). Furthermore Dagestan isn't a town nor a city. Its a republic within Russia (its capital is Derbent). Last but not least, this is what they call: WAR (you probably read about it in history books). So please, don't make me feel sorry for the poor russians.

Russians in Checenya are opressors, and in this role, Im tottaly with Chechens, and with me its same with every opressed nation in the world.
These videos are maybe gruesome, but again its their fight for freedom, and you would do the same if youre country and people are being "raped".
Killed russians shown on video arent maybe bad guys, but the politicians and russian government who send them should think about their and other people.

Beside that, these weapon designs are great, they show the genious ideas that come to mans mind when he is desperate and lacking of something.

The same could relate to our lives, we would appreciate more some things in our life if we dont get them too easily, thus if we maybe create something new.
"Necessity is mother of invention"

@Shadowmartyr: I still sympathize with them. Tell me when you have the russian special forces on video in Chechnya (you know, the russian death squads "cleaning" the town from civilians). Furthermore Dagestan isn't a town nor a city. Its a republic within Russia (its capital is Derbent). Last but not least, this is what they call: WAR (you probably read about it in history books). So please, don't make me feel sorry for the poor russians.

Beheading is an act of war that was done in the middle ages and beyond. Don't you think a simple gunshot execution style would do?

You show me the video where Russian Spetznaz cut into a mans neck with a dull blade, and hold his head up to the camera so you can hear him attempt to breath, it's barbaric.

Death squad by gun > beheading

Terror is a powerful weapon in war.

Instant death by bullet in head isn't as terrifying as having your head cut off with a dull knife, all while you're trying to breath through the blood gurgling down into your lungs through the gaping wound that is now your throat.

You show me the video where Russian Spetznaz cut into a mans neck with a dull blade, and hold his head up to the camera so you can hear him attempt to breath, it's barbaric.
The Russians committed atrocities in that war, too. I saw one report describing how after capturing a female sniper, the Russians attached one of her feet to one of their vehicles and the other foot to another large object, then ripped her apart.

If that's not barbaric, then I don't know what is. And the Russians had every conceivable advantage in that war, so if the Chechens had no excuse for committing atrocities, then the Russians had much less of an excuse. I really don't like to see that sort of thing on either side of a conflict, but of course it's going to happen.

Ultimately, unless one side or the other has some relation to my own interests, I tend to side with the underdog against the aggressor. I have nothing against Russians in general, but let's face it: it takes a hell of a lot more balls and resourcefulness to be a Chechen fighting the Russians than to be a Russian fighting the Chechens.

When ZOG declares eternal martial law, I hope at least one or two percent of Americans demonstrate ownership of balls similar to those of a Chechen or Palestinian guerrilla. As for homemade munitions, that's where this board comes in. (And TOTSE. :D ;))

Then you give the body back to the family. It is hard to fix a severed head for a funeral, and all of the family will know what happened. People will hear what happened to poor so-and-so that got his head lopped off, and they will fear that. This kind of barbarism gets peoples attention, it is terrifying, and it is effective.

A bullet is efficient, but commonplace. When you can't kill everyone, killing a few people as examples in a gruesome and terrible manner has long lasting repercussions. It may backfire too, creating more enemies who will show no mercy when they get their hands on you, but that is the chance you take as a killer. Most people are weak cows, display enough force and they can be controlled.

It may backfire too, creating more enemies who will show no mercy when they get their hands on you, but that is the chance you take as a killer. Most people are weak cows, display enough force and they can be controlled.

The entire group that did that supposedly was tortured and killed. The leader however is in Russia and on trial.

This is classic psychological war.
Russians cant afford to "strike back" with videos like those, but Im sure when cameras are off, they do more brutal attrocities.It is because of their relations with other nations, it wouldnt be smart to focus media attention on shits happening in Chechenya.
But, like wars in Middle East, waged by USA for oil, this is similar, but in Russian style, since Chechenya is vital for oil traffic, only difference is that in free world nobody gives a f... about that, since media attention is on Midde East.
On the other side, Chechens are desperate in their struggle, knowing that nobody in the world will help them, (most of the world couldnt show you on the map where chechenya is) so this is their cry to the world and Russia, they just want to show what is happening there and scare young russian conscripts with video.

Similar situation happened in my country, at the begining of war there was very little army equipment and weapons, and people literary carried everything, but the opposite (aggresor side) had everything, planes, tanks, ships, you name it.
Scarce of weapons brought some weapons designs
and importation of arms was officialy banned by EU ( thank them very much), but through some connections, arms still reached the country, of course, not so cheap, and some of the people who dealt with it used the money for their reasons (car, house, pool ).
Gruesome attrocities were normal, shown regulary on media, and this video is nothing compared to some shits happened in my country in first year of war, but instead of frightening us, it simply boosted our morale and people wanted to fight more and more.

When you cannot reach the head to cut it off, because it is in another country, you have to hit the fingers really, really hard to get the message back...

The entire group that did that supposedly was tortured and killed. The leader however is in Russia and on trial.

You have any media info for that ?

You have any media info for that ?

The video is quite old, but I remember several sources that are still on liveleak.com under the comments section of the videos (theres 3 parts to it). Don't have time to dig up the link right now, but it's on there.

Just watched the video clip on there :eek:

plus a couple more video clips related to that incident. :(

That just made me very angry and upset. :mad:

Of course, there has been war throughout the centuries. It just makes me more mad with the islamics, with all what they are doing.

I don't see the another world military armies, navies doing those things as the islamic terrorists are doing.

The Russian Army sure as hell didn't go in to shoot and blow up a school, like the Chechen islamic terrorists have done.

Also, The Russkies sure as hell didn't march on stage while a theater performance was playing on-stage only to make this a very serious life and death matter and not a very nice evening out on the town.

I will just say this, as much as I despise communism, I am with the Russians on this one.

When I first saw these I thought they we're all faked but now I understand the quality of these weapons is so high because these people found old guns left behind from WW2 which, you can see from the pictures, were used for spare parts. I'm amazed at these :D It makes me want to build my own :D

http://englishrussia.com/images/chechen_weapons/13.jpg

This particular one looks like a sheridan air rifle stock with rifle internals retro fitted.

The SMGs look like cheap Tec-9's

The video is quite old, but I remember several sources that are still on liveleak.com under the comments section of the videos (theres 3 parts to it). Don't have time to dig up the link right now, but it's on there.

Yeah, I saw similar description on some site, but I wouldnt say that its true, it looks to me more like satisfiying people moral standards, they would feel better if they found out that ones who did that horrible act were "punished".
Im looking for some media info, from newspapers, Tv, etc. not made up commentaries.

WWII @ First, there is no communism in Russia since 1990. so your setting with russians "beside" their communism sounds paradoxal.
Second, if you think killing civilians and captured soldiers, blowing up theaters, scools, etc. is speciality of "islamic terrorists" only,
then you know NOTHING about war and armies, present and past, and that is especially weird when we see your nick, "WWII".
I suggest you to study all sides in any conflict and not jump to conclusion just by watching some videos or listening what your news say about something.

Kaydon @ To me, the stock looks like its cut out from piece of wood.I wonder whats the precison of that "rifle".

WWII @ First, there is no communism in Russia since 1990. so your setting with russians "beside" their communism sounds paradoxal.
Second, if you think killing civilians and captured soldiers, blowing up theaters, scools, etc. is speciality of "islamic terrorists" only,
then you know NOTHING about war and armies, present and past, and that is especially weird when we see your nick, "WWII".
I suggest you to study all sides in any conflict and not jump to conclusion just by watching some videos or listening what your news say about something.

Well, my only response is that I have been studying WWII for a long time, my grandfather fought in WWII so naturally I have an interest in all things WWII and I am a military buff with the tanks, planes, jeeps of that time etc.

I am fully aware of the evils that communism has done all over the world, not just in Russia. They don't take things to the extreme like the Chechens are doing.

As for the beheading video clip, that was very terrible. I guess what I was trying to say here is that most people when they are in the military have no reason to behead somebody. Normally that is done with bullets, bayonets and savage hand to hand combat.

I have studied the history of beheadings from medieval times to the French use of the guillotine as a crime & punishment method.

The Saudis also use the beheading method as a crime & punishment method.

Please note that the Saudis do not use beheadings as a tool of terror.

These Chechens are using beheadings in the wrong way, as a tool of terror.

Personally, I think beheadings are despicable and very disgusting.

I would understand if American soldiers or a legitimate military government soldiers had to cut the throat of the enemy because they are low on ammo and the bullets are very precious so they use the bayonet to cut throats and let them bleed which is still horrible, in itself. Preferably a rifle gunshot would be more appropriate.

( Notice I said no beheadings here, just cut the throat to conserve ammo. )

Finally in WWII, I think the Japanese were the experts with the sword, bayonet and sharp knife instruments and they had no problems using the bayonet as seen in this video.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RR0h8o4NTPc

I am fully aware of the evils that communism has done all over the world, not just in Russia. They don't take things to the extreme like the Chechens are doing.The Chechens are saints compared to what the communists were like.

Which would you rather die from: a beheading, or having nails hammered through your skull into your brain? The latter is one example of the type of thing the communists did routinely. Also, please note the earlier example I gave of what the Russians did to the female sniper.

As for the beheading video clip, that was very terrible. I guess what I was trying to say here is that most people when they are in the military have no reason to behead somebody. Normally that is done with bullets, bayonets and savage hand to hand combat.Or by dropping high explosives and/or napalm from the safety of aircraft, causing death by dismemberment, suffocation, and/or burns -- often to innocent people.

Personally, I think beheadings are despicable and very disgusting.Beheading is actually a relatively merciful death if the major blood vessels are severed, though it can be gruesome depending on how it's done. I can think of many FAR worse ways to die.

I would understand if American soldiers or a legitimate military government soldiers had to cut the throat of the enemy because they are low on ammo and the bullets are very precious so they use the bayonet to cut throats and let them bleed which is still horrible, in itself. Preferably a rifle gunshot would be more appropriate.Who defines what a "legitimate" fighter is, and on what basis? Or why is a soldier affiliated with a nation any more legitimate than a guerrilla who fights for the cause of some group?

I say that if someone wearing the uniform of a superpower has the right to kill an enemy at the direction of a government, then so does anyone and everyone else at his own direction. A person doesn't gain any special right to kill just by putting on a uniform or being affiliated with a government. People have been conditioned to think that way, but it's just not true.

One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter. And again, there is nothing special at all about beheading, and it's a far more merciful way of killing than, say, indiscriminately bombing civilian population areas with cruise missile launched from a ship or dropping napalm on someone from a jet.

Youre thinking of (ideal) war as too romantic, soldiers vs. soldiers, no beheadings, bullets/bayonets/hand to hand only, well the war is not a Counterstrike.

Of course most of people in the war should act "normaly" (kill just soldiers) but in the war often sick minds come to power, or, more,
normal people "break" and start being worse psychopats than any psycho that was mad before the war.
Its not easy to imagine (and if it happens, to do), what would you do, if enemy (aggresor) killed your whole family, your friends and your neighbours.
Then, from your perspective, beheading of some captured soldier seems a normal thing to do.

In the video russian soldiers looks tottaly innocent and pitiful, (and probably they are) but, who knows, maybe if the roles are switched they would do just the same(or worse) to chechens (and they did, but its not leaked on the internet).
Again, I say, its not hard thing to do in a war, maybe youre pissed, maybe you have a bad day, maybe youre angry, or maybe your fellow combatants forced you, and you do some gruesome act just for not being called a "pussy" by your fellow soldiers.
If you think that you are too moral to not to do crimes in war, fuck that, you never know till it happens to you.

I really dont know why you posted movie as a reference to "japanese bayonet skills", are you thinking we are here some nerds born withouth half of brain?

@Liberty of death, really good post !

Im not here to criticise USA army, but I would like you to see that war when, for instance, Mexicans attack Texas, and you live in Houston under constant barrage of fire and fight to defend your neighborhood, people and town, is not the same war like when soldiers are 5000 km from their homeland and deceiving themselves that their are fighting for some noble cause and to protect the people of that country.

If asked, in which war would you like to fight ?

Honestly It wouldn't bother me as much if they weren't Arabs. But seeing as they yell "Allah Akbar" and laugh while they are cutting his throat it just pisses me the fuck off. Mainly because they cut throats because they believe that it keeps their own kind from seeing Allah. So not only is this a pretty gruesome way to go but is is the equivalent of me killing someone and shitting in their mouths in spite. Its not the act of killing the person that is offensive it is the reasoning behind choosing that way to do it. Had they just executed him with a bullet in the back of the head it would have been more acceptable than cutting his throat for religious and sadistic reasons.

There is killing because you have to and then there is killing for the joy of it. This video is the latter.


Sure the Russian incident was despicable too due to the sadistic way they carried it out, but the fact that the A-rabs use their religious beliefs as a basis for choosing to behead someone it just bothers me more.

But that is just my way of thinking and my opinion. "Opinions are like assholes..."

Honestly It wouldn't bother me as much if they weren't Arabs. But seeing as they yell "Allah Akbar" and laugh while they are cutting his throat it just pisses me the fuck off. Mainly because they cut throats because they believe that it keeps their own kind from seeing Allah. So not only is this a pretty gruesome way to go but is is the equivalent of me killing someone and shitting in their mouths in spite. Its not the act of killing the person that is offensive it is the reasoning behind choosing that way to do it. Had they just executed him with a bullet in the back of the head it would have been more acceptable than cutting his throat for religious and sadistic reasons.

There is killing because you have to and then there is killing for the joy of it. This video is the latter.


Sure the Russian incident was despicable too due to the sadistic way they carried it out, but the fact that the A-rabs use their religious beliefs as a basis for choosing to behead someone it just bothers me more.

But that is just my way of thinking and my opinion. "Opinions are like assholes..."

Agreed, I couldn't have said it better, myself.

For example, I am a Christian okay, The U.S. Gov't calls up a military draft then I am in the U.S. Military and I go off to war to stop arabic terrorism then now I am faced with the task of executing arabic terrorists. I wouldn't do it for fun or anything like that and certainly no beheadings. I would only put a bullet in each of the terrorist's head or just simply cut their throat if I am low on ammo but I would not take any pleasure in it neither am I going to invoke God's name as I put a bullet in each one or cut their throat open. God has nothing to do with it.

The arabic terrorists are using allah as a pre-text to murder and that isn't right.

I also think the arabic terrorists are twisting the words from the quran when it says to smite their necks which means to behead and I think at that time way back in ancient history there were only bows and arrows, swords and giant catapults as seen in the movie, " Kingdom of Heaven " then I can see why beheadings would have made perfect sense because the armies on both sides fought with swords. Today we use M-16 v.s. AK-47 so in that respect, I think the terrorists are twisting the quran's words as they do on alots of things. I know the Bible does say in Revelations that Christians will be beheaded, basically martyred for witnessing the Gospel of Jesus Christ and we still will go to Heaven, they still lose. That is why it is very important to be saved by accepting Jesus Christ into your heart and life. That is something you will have to do for yourself and no, I am not proselytizing so you can go to http://www.chick.com and read the Christian tracts then read for yourself. Many in another countries do not have the freedom to read about the teachings of Jesus Christ. I think that is sad so that is something that you will have to do between God and yourself.

I think I have drifted off-topic enough and please do have a Merry Christmas and God Bless :)