megalomania
June 18th, 2003, 03:47 PM
phyrelord
Frequent Poster
Posts: 135
From:
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 01-13-2001 06:18 PM
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would it be possible to make a pneumatic gun that worked like a syringe, with a plunger inside another tube and two magnetic fields pushing on each other so as to force the barrel with the projectile back into the air chamber. does it sound like it might be possible to do? i would have to use an electric coil around the two pvc chambers, but i think it might work. any ideas or opinions?
Anthony
Moderator
Posts: 2306
From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 01-13-2001 09:13 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So something like a rail gun? I've thought about electromagentically propelled projectile weapons and came to the conclusion that they are impractical unless you got a small, portable fusion generator to run it. The amount of energy that comes from burning a gram or two of smokeless powder is a lot, batteries containing enough power to give as many shots as you could carry of regular ammo would be insanely big and heavy.
Not to mention the possible effects of such powerful electromagnets so close to your brain
Zero
Frequent Poster
Posts: 93
From: ...
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 01-14-2001 08:49 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Basically what you described is a magnetic pellet gun. Airguns use the same piston principle, but with a spring. If you're hell bent on using electricity, I think Axsor makes an electrically operated airgun...
------------------
~Zero the Inestimable
The A Files
{Link is a direct download.}
Mr Cool
Frequent Poster
Posts: 991
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 02-18-2001 09:07 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I made a simple coil gun once - I ran it off 240 volts, 60 Hz mains, and it drew quite a lot of power. It fired small, strong magnets 0.5" by 0.25", and it had 20 coils wound on the barrel (plastic tubing), each the same but spaced further and further apart so that the bullet was always being pushed from behind and pulled from the front when a magnetic field was present. When the field was at zero in the cycle, the bullet was in the coil, and as it left the coil the field built up to max half way between coils, and dropped down again as it entered the next coil and so on. It fired the magnets pretty fast and cost next to nothing to build, but it wouldn't work as a weapon because it's mains operated and very long.
Mr Cool
Frequent Poster
Posts: 991
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 02-18-2001 09:13 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The coils were kinda like this:
Coils:___NvvvS______SvvvN______NvvvS..etc.
Magnet:-------->SN--->
Then when the current changed direction they were like this:
Coils:___SvvvN______NvvvS______SvvvN..etc.
Magnet:------------------->SN--->
Well, hopefully you get the idea.
I don't know how well this'll come out when I post it. ASCII art has a habit of getting fucked up.
[This message has been edited by Mr Cool (edited February 18, 2001).]
Jhonbus
Frequent Poster
Posts: 351
From:
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 02-18-2001 01:47 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
How did you know how far apart to space the coils? The way I was thinking of working it out would be to work out the acceleration of the projectile and place the coils at 1/120 second intervals (for 60Hz), is this what you did?
Sounds like a good idea, I may just have to make one
[This message has been edited by Jhonbus (edited February 18, 2001).]
Mick
Frequent Poster
Posts: 232
From:
Registered: OCT 2000
posted 02-19-2001 03:13 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
guys to post Ascii type pictures and stuff, use the ]code[ command
same as the image command, only with the word "code" in the brackets...
Mr Cool
Frequent Poster
Posts: 991
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 02-19-2001 04:32 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, I worked it out like that and then tweaked it by trial and error.
Ezikiel
Frequent Poster
Posts: 66
From: New Delhi, India
Registered: MAY 2001
posted 05-30-2001 08:24 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hey guys !!! I have one coil gun too, works pretty good according to what I was expecting out of it. But my question is ....how did u switch the coils on in the required sequence cause my coil gun has only one coil.
------------------
"Go out in a BLAZE OF GLORY"
Ezikiel
Frequent Poster
Posts: 66
From: New Delhi, India
Registered: MAY 2001
posted 05-30-2001 08:26 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The above question is directed to Mr. Cool.
------------------
"Go out in a BLAZE OF GLORY"
Fenrir
New Member
Posts: 5
From:
Registered: MAY 2001
posted 05-31-2001 02:10 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Not quite the answer you're looking for, but this guy has made a gauss (electromagnetic) "gun" using capacitors, a large transistor, and some thick wire. He has made both a single stage and a multi stage version. I believe that the single stage version is now up to about the same muzzle energy as 3x that of a high powered sniper rifle, or 8 grams of powder, or so he says. http://www.powerlabs.org/gaussgun.htm
SATANIC
Frequent Poster
Posts: 237
From: australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-01-2001 12:48 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
i don't quite understand, does anyone have pics, especially cut away views?
HMTD Factory
Frequent Poster
Posts: 225
From:
Registered: FEB 2001
posted 06-02-2001 03:22 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
To Anthony :
What phyrelord said is a electromagnetism actuated piston gun, much like a full-auto airsoft except they use a motor to drive the piston.
The coil gun others mentioned are called "Gaussian rifles", using coils and a magnet projectile, it has a maximum equilibrium speed due to the countering effect of magnet to the coil.
A rail gun uses "Lawrence force" to push the
projectile, can reach higher than 20000fps. of muzzle velocity.
Rail guns are not to be confused with "Gaussian rifles" as they are different.
Mr Cool
Frequent Poster
Posts: 991
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 06-02-2001 01:48 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I didn't need to time the coils. They were all on, all the time, but with their polarities constantly changing over. This type only works with permanent magnets as the projectiles though. Small, cylindrical NdFeB magnets are the best, but expensive.
I once tried to make a rail gun as well, using graphite discs as the projectiles, but when the switch was activated (this could be done once per switch, as they were welded closed by the current) there was a huge bang and the discs were shattered.
HMTD Factory
Frequent Poster
Posts: 225
From:
Registered: FEB 2001
posted 06-04-2001 03:15 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mr Cool, do you mean the disk breaks before it was shot out?
Predator
Frequent Poster
Posts: 141
From: Unknown
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-04-2001 06:10 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Aren't you meant to inject load projectiles in a rail-gun type device?
They don't just move from a static position on their own. they need a shove or to already have some kinetic energy when they contact the rails.
Frequent Poster
Posts: 135
From:
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 01-13-2001 06:18 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
would it be possible to make a pneumatic gun that worked like a syringe, with a plunger inside another tube and two magnetic fields pushing on each other so as to force the barrel with the projectile back into the air chamber. does it sound like it might be possible to do? i would have to use an electric coil around the two pvc chambers, but i think it might work. any ideas or opinions?
Anthony
Moderator
Posts: 2306
From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 01-13-2001 09:13 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
So something like a rail gun? I've thought about electromagentically propelled projectile weapons and came to the conclusion that they are impractical unless you got a small, portable fusion generator to run it. The amount of energy that comes from burning a gram or two of smokeless powder is a lot, batteries containing enough power to give as many shots as you could carry of regular ammo would be insanely big and heavy.
Not to mention the possible effects of such powerful electromagnets so close to your brain
Zero
Frequent Poster
Posts: 93
From: ...
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 01-14-2001 08:49 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Basically what you described is a magnetic pellet gun. Airguns use the same piston principle, but with a spring. If you're hell bent on using electricity, I think Axsor makes an electrically operated airgun...
------------------
~Zero the Inestimable
The A Files
{Link is a direct download.}
Mr Cool
Frequent Poster
Posts: 991
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 02-18-2001 09:07 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I made a simple coil gun once - I ran it off 240 volts, 60 Hz mains, and it drew quite a lot of power. It fired small, strong magnets 0.5" by 0.25", and it had 20 coils wound on the barrel (plastic tubing), each the same but spaced further and further apart so that the bullet was always being pushed from behind and pulled from the front when a magnetic field was present. When the field was at zero in the cycle, the bullet was in the coil, and as it left the coil the field built up to max half way between coils, and dropped down again as it entered the next coil and so on. It fired the magnets pretty fast and cost next to nothing to build, but it wouldn't work as a weapon because it's mains operated and very long.
Mr Cool
Frequent Poster
Posts: 991
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 02-18-2001 09:13 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The coils were kinda like this:
Coils:___NvvvS______SvvvN______NvvvS..etc.
Magnet:-------->SN--->
Then when the current changed direction they were like this:
Coils:___SvvvN______NvvvS______SvvvN..etc.
Magnet:------------------->SN--->
Well, hopefully you get the idea.
I don't know how well this'll come out when I post it. ASCII art has a habit of getting fucked up.
[This message has been edited by Mr Cool (edited February 18, 2001).]
Jhonbus
Frequent Poster
Posts: 351
From:
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 02-18-2001 01:47 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
How did you know how far apart to space the coils? The way I was thinking of working it out would be to work out the acceleration of the projectile and place the coils at 1/120 second intervals (for 60Hz), is this what you did?
Sounds like a good idea, I may just have to make one
[This message has been edited by Jhonbus (edited February 18, 2001).]
Mick
Frequent Poster
Posts: 232
From:
Registered: OCT 2000
posted 02-19-2001 03:13 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
guys to post Ascii type pictures and stuff, use the ]code[ command
same as the image command, only with the word "code" in the brackets...
Mr Cool
Frequent Poster
Posts: 991
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 02-19-2001 04:32 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Yeah, I worked it out like that and then tweaked it by trial and error.
Ezikiel
Frequent Poster
Posts: 66
From: New Delhi, India
Registered: MAY 2001
posted 05-30-2001 08:24 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Hey guys !!! I have one coil gun too, works pretty good according to what I was expecting out of it. But my question is ....how did u switch the coils on in the required sequence cause my coil gun has only one coil.
------------------
"Go out in a BLAZE OF GLORY"
Ezikiel
Frequent Poster
Posts: 66
From: New Delhi, India
Registered: MAY 2001
posted 05-30-2001 08:26 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
The above question is directed to Mr. Cool.
------------------
"Go out in a BLAZE OF GLORY"
Fenrir
New Member
Posts: 5
From:
Registered: MAY 2001
posted 05-31-2001 02:10 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Not quite the answer you're looking for, but this guy has made a gauss (electromagnetic) "gun" using capacitors, a large transistor, and some thick wire. He has made both a single stage and a multi stage version. I believe that the single stage version is now up to about the same muzzle energy as 3x that of a high powered sniper rifle, or 8 grams of powder, or so he says. http://www.powerlabs.org/gaussgun.htm
SATANIC
Frequent Poster
Posts: 237
From: australia
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-01-2001 12:48 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
i don't quite understand, does anyone have pics, especially cut away views?
HMTD Factory
Frequent Poster
Posts: 225
From:
Registered: FEB 2001
posted 06-02-2001 03:22 AM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
To Anthony :
What phyrelord said is a electromagnetism actuated piston gun, much like a full-auto airsoft except they use a motor to drive the piston.
The coil gun others mentioned are called "Gaussian rifles", using coils and a magnet projectile, it has a maximum equilibrium speed due to the countering effect of magnet to the coil.
A rail gun uses "Lawrence force" to push the
projectile, can reach higher than 20000fps. of muzzle velocity.
Rail guns are not to be confused with "Gaussian rifles" as they are different.
Mr Cool
Frequent Poster
Posts: 991
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 06-02-2001 01:48 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I didn't need to time the coils. They were all on, all the time, but with their polarities constantly changing over. This type only works with permanent magnets as the projectiles though. Small, cylindrical NdFeB magnets are the best, but expensive.
I once tried to make a rail gun as well, using graphite discs as the projectiles, but when the switch was activated (this could be done once per switch, as they were welded closed by the current) there was a huge bang and the discs were shattered.
HMTD Factory
Frequent Poster
Posts: 225
From:
Registered: FEB 2001
posted 06-04-2001 03:15 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Mr Cool, do you mean the disk breaks before it was shot out?
Predator
Frequent Poster
Posts: 141
From: Unknown
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-04-2001 06:10 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Aren't you meant to inject load projectiles in a rail-gun type device?
They don't just move from a static position on their own. they need a shove or to already have some kinetic energy when they contact the rails.