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View Full Version : Knives, the Real Steel.


Hang-Man
April 25th, 2004, 01:46 AM
I'm looking for a fixed blade that can take daily use, and have decided to stop buying shit from flea markets. Are the Cold Steel, Spyderco, and other high-end knives worth the extra cash?

Also, does anyone have a balisong they find particularly tough?

Bert
April 25th, 2004, 02:40 AM
Are the Cold Steel, Spyderco, and other high-end knives worth the extra cash?

Cheap ass knives suck.

The cold steel fixed blades are pretty reasonable for what you get. They have a seconds section on their web page that you should look at-

Spyderco are good, but there main thing is folders, IMHO.

Personaly, I cary a leatherman wave. If I thought I needed a weapon not a tool, a knife wouldn't be my choice.

xperk
April 25th, 2004, 08:15 AM
Hang man,

it all depends on what your daily use is, if you can legally carry a fixed blade then in the low end of the price range if would go for a swedish work knife.. dirt cheap, good steel - main drawback is aesthetics: plastic handle and sheet - they are however extremely tough.
Second in line I would go for military surplus, like the airforce survival knife or the bowie.

I have a cold steel tanto laminated steel the kraton handle sucks bad and the blade is due to the thickness not very practical for anything else but ribcaging opponents - the handle came apart on a trip to central america.
My advice would be to stay away from kraton or other fancy space age materials - especially the ones glued on to the handle ( a Gerber came apart on a trip to asia ) seems to me like the fancy solutions don't work in hot humid temperatures.

If you want to spend go for a full tang with a stacked leather or wood handle. If you are a camper / survivalist go for a machete and a nice medium-sized folder.

Hang-Man
April 25th, 2004, 11:47 AM
To put the Kraton on the handle they heat it so it expands, then hammer it on and let it cool. That may explain it falling apart in humid conditions.

The leatherman wave is a nice tool, but I need a larger blade. I'm used to carrying a small Machete I brought back from Costa Rica but it's reaching the end of its rope. It needs to be able to hold up to everyday use in a farm environment plus the odd camping/canoe trip. If Kraton is no good, that rules out most Cold Steel, so maybe something like this:

http://www.1sks.com/store/becker-knife-and-tool-combat-utility-knife.html.

Anyone own a Camillus?

tom haggen
April 25th, 2004, 01:48 PM
Cold steel makes a good knife, possibly made out of 1040 medium carbon steel. I own a gurka style, cold steel knife and i'm quite satisfied. I would recommend Bench Made Knives. They are used a lot by the military and law Enforcement. Their spring loaded model is quite popular, and they are made right here in Oregon. They are quite possibly the best knife around. Also, if your a fan of European engineering, Puma, Made in Germany offers a knife made out of high quality stainless steel. I used to own one of those. However, I didn't really like the design they used for there locking mechanisms. But it's the common design used by many knife manufacturers, and I think it needs a big improvement. Try to find a knife made from 440C stainless steel, this type of stainless yields the highest hardness of hardenable stainless steels.http://worldwideknives.com/EntrekUSA/Entrek1.html Heres some knives made out of 440C stainless... I like the destroyer :cool:

jelly
April 25th, 2004, 02:12 PM
If you have much money, buy a Busse knife. These are the most reliable and durable knives with a fixed blade.

If no take a look at Swamp Rat knives (the "Busse" version for the poor) http://www.swamprat.com/knives.html

Or grab one of the best European knives. I recommend the Swedish Faellkniven A1 with a 6mm blade made of V10 steel http://www.fallkniven.com/a1f1/a1_en.html.

You can find interesting reviews for nearly all good knives at http://www.bladeforums.com.

Bigfoot
May 6th, 2004, 11:31 AM
My substitute machete is an antique Mauser bayonet. Look around for the stainless ones--not exactly common, but buy 2 or more. I suspect that the stainless ones were an experimental melt, because my first one has non-homogenous alloy--parts of the blade are higher chrome and lots harder than the rest. Makes sharpening interesting. Others I have are a bit better. But hey, for under USD$20, a good, tough knife for splitting firewood, chopping brush/saplings, general hard labor that a folder just won't do.

aikon
May 6th, 2004, 05:53 PM
Please have a look at www.katzknives.com.
They are producing one of the best knives I've ever seen, IMHO.

Jacks Complete
May 10th, 2004, 06:29 PM
I have a rather nice, rather old kukri. Picked it up at an antique furniture shop, of all places. Used it in anger on a tree recently, and it did a great job. The only thing is that the handle is rather small, and has an odd sort of circular ridge, which cuts into my hand a little. It would raise a blister after a lot of use.

They are a heavy backed blade, and the shape lets you cut deep into wood without much effort. Mine is about 14" long.

If you get one, you might want to consider a stainless blade or something, as the leather sheath has caused some rust over the years.

New ones can be quite expensive...

Hang-Man
May 11th, 2004, 07:11 PM
A kurkri is a machete as far as I am concerned, and while I allways liked the style, its hard to cary and use. But I'm glad you brought up steels. Most knives I'm looking at are either AUS-6 or 8. Maby 0170-6C (Cold Steels 'carbon V' is very similar iirc) allthough a few (like the kershaw bump and the odd spyderco) are made in S30V. I don't mind if it's not stainless so long as it takes (and keeps) a good edge. I have had a knife in M1 before and liked it. But it only seems to be used in dive knives, or knives designed for life in salt water. There must be a reason it's not used elsewhere. I think I'll order a Camillus for a fixed blade, they make several that look solid. Maby a low end Benchmade axis if I can find the cash. Some links I have come across in my search: (why is html code off?)

Camillus: http://www.camillusknives.com/1mainframe.htm?bkt/index.shtml~main
I hate frame based sites.. Go to "BK&T" for the fixed knives I was talking about.

Benchmade: http://www.benchmade.com/index.asp
Really high prices, but I have heard nothing but good things about them.

CRKT: http://www.crkt.com/m16mil.html
This page is badly put together so I just linked to the one I was looking at. Good prices and looks like a solid knife.

Ontario Knives: http://www.ontarioknife.com/machetes.html
Everyone needs a good machete.

How does everyone feel about the a tanto tip? And what do you use to sharpen/maintain your knives?

Jacks Complete
May 12th, 2004, 07:13 PM
Steels are pretty hard to get your head round. Everyone seems to call them by different names, and you tend to need a look-up table anyway to see what percentages of what they have in them, the hardness, and so on.

The main stainless steel is 304 (Grade S30400, aka. ), which accounts for over half of all stainless sold. It gets used for everything, including crap stainless steel knives, cutlery, etc. Keeps a vaguely keen edge, but cannot be sharpened to anything like a good carbon steel. Fairly hard, and strong. Suffers from spotting and the other weird corrosion touches you get on cutlery, mostly from salts, I believe.

The second is 316, which is about half of what's left, or about 20% of the total production. It has better corrosion resistance.

Sadly, neither of these are good knife steels!

Less stainless, but still quite rust resistant, you get the Chrome Vanandium tool steels, which would seem to be a good choice, though they are seriously hard to machine, and they tend to be drop-forged into things like spanners and screwdrivers (that means the still semi-molten metal is hammered into a forming mold) This seems to hold a good edge, but may chip due to being over-hard.

Plain high-carbon steel is last, with a tendency to rust rapidly under the right (wrong) conditions. Holds a bloody sharp edge, can be easily and simply tempered and hardened, and is easy to resharpen. Much softer, so the edge is more likely to dent on impact with a nail, etc. than to chip, so it can be bent back and touched up a little, re-sharpened and tempered, and restored without too much heartache.

Of course, you could try some kind of rust stopper. I just got a sample of some super aerospace compound which is supposed to be the greatest thing ever, something 50, which claims to get under the rust and bond to the metal molecules, stopping rust and corrosion forever (unless worn away) but we will see...

randall
May 31st, 2004, 07:16 PM
Ka-Bar makes a pretty solid fighting knife. they run about $40 us. the marines have been using them since ww2 iirc. they also make some nice tanto blades and hunting knives
The Mauser bayonet is also a good choice for those bigger jobs, built as tough and reliable as the rifle it was made for.

jelly
October 13th, 2004, 01:40 AM
I'm looking for a fixed blade that can take daily use
Extrema Ratio, an Italian manufacturer of tactical knives (tanto style) for police/military/special forces has now developed a small but strong and massive backup knife with a blade thickness of 6.3 mm... the perfect "every day carry" chisel... eh... knife :D

Fixed blade SHRAPNEL by Extrema Ratio:

http://www.extremaratio.com/ing/listaConfig.php?id_serie=19

http://jellybelly84.tripod.com/knife (German text)

tom haggen
October 13th, 2004, 02:26 AM
Yes Jack, you said it. Steels are hard to identify when it comes to different countries. However, I notice you seem to be using some recognizable numbers, and you are from the UK and I am from the US. Anyway, your right about carbon steels, as they to seem to be the perfect carbon to iron ratio to keep your tool from cracking. A good carbon steel would be O6 tool steel. The "O" of course stands for oil hardening. I own a copy of The Machinist's Handbook, and I must say that the properties of 440C stainless steel seem quite desirable in a knife. So hang man did you ever decide on anything? A benchmade maybe?

nbk2000
October 13th, 2004, 05:21 PM
From the Extremea Ratio site:


elite unit of FOLGORE brigade of ITALIAN ARMY


'Elite' and 'Italian Army' in the same sentence?! :p :D

BTW, ANYTHING with the word 'Extreme' in it that doesn't involve jumping out of a hovering helicopter to ski down an 85° slope, is likely to be EXTREMELY lame. Not everything, but certainly the vast majority. See 'Extreme', think 'Lame', and act accordingly.

tom haggen
October 13th, 2004, 05:37 PM
Extreme Close Up!!!! Extreme Close Up!!! Wu Wu Wu Wu Wayne's World Wayne's World Party Time Excellent!

nbk2000
October 14th, 2004, 05:21 PM
Case in point! :)

.......................

meselfs
October 14th, 2004, 05:28 PM
I find that the best knive is a victorinox :D.

But if you want something better, you want a liquidmetal knife:

http://www.physics.mun.ca/~sstamp/knives/clark_model_10.html

Unfortunately the blade chips very easily, but for work that's low impact this knife supposedly is far better then a SS knife. Information about the new metal:

http://www.liquidmetal.com
http://www.liquidmetal.com/news/dsp.news.04x204.asp

SweNMFan
October 14th, 2004, 06:34 PM
I love my Cold Steel Tanto but it sucks as a work knife, unless you are a hitman and it is ridiculusly expensive.

http://store.knifecenter.com/pgi-ProductSpec?CS13AN

Same goes for the SOG Bowie,

http://store.knifecenter.com/pgi-Product%20Spec?sog1,

nbk2000
October 14th, 2004, 08:56 PM
The best knife for 'wet' work would be one made yourself from scrap steel.

No traceable manufacturer and you can make it anyway you want and beat the thing to death to find out its weaknesses before making another just like it for use.

I read about how "Wild Bill" Hickok would take great pains with his guns, checking every primer, changing the powder every day, making the bullets himself, etc. His belief was that, since his life depended on his guns working EVERY TIME, he would treat them as such.

So too with any piece of gear you're going to be carrying into battle.