megalomania
June 21st, 2003, 12:11 PM
endotherm
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From: dunno
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 06-11-2001 04:10 PM
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This never really happened, it is pure fiction but i will write about it like it's true just for ease of reading
I had like 2 gallons of Lye Drain unclogger lying around so i was bored and decided to do an old favorie trick, filled up a balloon, hooray great, little bitch bang. Then i realize it seems like it would be really hard but in actuality it is real easy to fill up a garbage bag, so i rigged it up, with a super huge display wine bottle with like 2 gallons of lye and a pound of aluminum, i ran this through a hose into a little beer bottle where it was filtered through water, in about a 2 minutes the garbage bag was clearly inflted, so i hooked up an air compressor, and filled the other 30% up with air, i attached about 4 min worth of Visco to a pack of matches and taped it on, i lit it in a field behind my house where i could see it from my window, it was about 500-600 yards away, i could just make it out from my window, then it dissapeared, just dissapeaded, no noise, no flash nothing, like a popped ballon, Well that was preety fucking gay i thought and BOOOOOOOOOOM, it startled me so much i was like shaking, it sounded like thunder, like if you were just hangin' out in your house watching TV you wouldnt just be like, what was that, you would jump out of your chair,BY far the loudest thing ive ever heard, for under like 6 bucks you could make something that would litterally shake your neighborhood... I have a new toy.....
J
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From: United Kingdom
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-11-2001 05:32 PM
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Watch out for static! If I were you, I'd make sure the bag is firmly grounded before filling with either gas, but even with these precautions there is still a danger.
How much damage did it do (if any)?
J
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endotherm
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From: dunno
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posted 06-11-2001 06:16 PM
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J- well i wouldn't really know, because i didn' really do it but if i had to make something up i would say it did no structurual damage to the ground or any surrounduings (no crater) , the biggest piece i found of garbage bag was about the size of a sheet of paper, other than some garbage bag shreds around, you wouldnt even know there was just a large explsoion, this doesn't mean that you could light them off in your room...to all those KeWLs out there,they definitley have a lot of pushing power, it doesnt have much power by VOD most likely, but definitely creates a lot of pushing pressure judging by thge sound,this thing could push and compress a large volume of gas.
i want to emphasize the sound was just really tremendous, it was like too loud, like it wasn't like some people might not notice,believe,i got my point across (whatever point that was)
and also J, I went over the inside with Supercats antistatic spray, it's funny considering i use this in my "Fake" piezo electric combustion cannon, its a paradox of some sort, using something to prevent an explosion, that i use to cause an explosion, things like that are real deep and...wait, what did i jut say, are hydrogen fumes toxic? Just Foolin'
[This message has been edited by endotherm (edited June 11, 2001).]
blackadder
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Posts: 315
From: London
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 06-12-2001 12:18 PM
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Yeah, I've experimented with these things tons of times. They rule!
I used to place two wires hooked up to model rocket ignitor inside the bag. Then, I would chuck in an aerosol can with tape over the button, so aerosol can will be spraying constantly. Then the bag would be sealed, by pulling on the string things, and tying the top bit so that you get a knot in the actual bag. Then, I would wait till bag inflated to the maximum capacity, and then put the two wires to the batteries, and BANG!!!
Eventually I progressed to using propane, butane, and eventually hydrogen. I never bothered putting the air compressor in, I just left a bit of air in to start with.
Remember to tape bricks to the hydrogen binbag to prevent it from flying away, that nearly happened once.
Mr Cool
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From: None of your bloody business!
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posted 06-12-2001 01:09 PM
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Why did you progress to hydrogen? Both butane AND propane are more powerful!
Anthony
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From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-12-2001 02:02 PM
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I once filled a bin/garbage bag with hydrogen, as a step up from hydogen filled ballons which give a fairly impressive bang.
After attaching it ot the cat for a while, I release it and it didn't go bang, it just gave a gentle fireball and crashed burning in someone's garden. I think it's the pressure of hydogen in a ballon that gives the bang.
A bag full of just propane or butane can take several seconds to burn.
endotherm
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From: dunno
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 06-12-2001 02:34 PM
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quote:
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Originally posted by Mr Cool:
Why did you progress to hydrogen? Both butane AND propane are more powerful!
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Ummmm, where did you come up with this?
Mr Cool
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From: None of your bloody business!
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posted 06-12-2001 03:51 PM
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Hydrogen:
Equation = 2H2 + O2 --> 2H2O
You must break 2 H-H bonds and 1 O=O bond to cause a reaction. This requires a total of (397+(2*436)) = 1269 kJ
This is the amount of energy that is used up when 72 litres of hydrogen and oxygen explode (there are 3 moles of gas, each taking up 24 litres at rtp).
The reaction gives out energy by making 4 H-O bonds, each releasing 464 kJ, thus releasing a total of 1856 kJ. Subtract the energy needed to break the original bonds, and you find that: 1856 - 1269 = 587 kJ/72 L
1 litre of hydrogen and oxygen burning in an optimal ratio therefore produces 8.153 kJ of energy.
Propane:
Equation = C3H8 + 5O2 --> 3CO2 + 4H2O
You must break 2 C-C bonds, 8 C-H bonds, and 5 O=O bonds to cause a reaction. This requires a total of ((2*347)+(8*435)+(5*397)) = 6159 kJ.
This is the amount of energy needed for 144 litres of propane and oxygen.
The reaction gives out energy by making 6 C=O bonds and 8 H-O bonds. This releases a total of ((6*803)+(8*464)) = 8530 kJ. Subtracting the 6159 kJ required to break the bonds leaves 2371 kJ produced by 144 litres.
1 litre of propane and oxygen burning in an optimal ratio therefore produces 16.465 kJ of energy.
You can see that a bag full of propane and oxygen will release more than twice as much energy as an identical bag of hydogen and oxygen. Do you want me to do it for butane as well? Check them if you like, just look up the bond energies in any chemistry text book.
ANTI-SYSTEM
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From: FL. USA
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posted 06-12-2001 05:15 PM
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Your both right in a way. Hydrogen is better for this due to its higher speed of burn. butane and propane are more powerful if the way of creating more gas volume but it takes a lot longer to catchup to hydrogen. by the time it does the bag is torn or burt open allowing all the gasses to escape.
endotherm
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Posts: 164
From: dunno
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 06-12-2001 06:17 PM
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quote:
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Originally posted by ANTI-SYSTEM:
butane and propane are more powerful if the way of creating more gas volume but it takes a lot longer to catchup to hydrogen. by the time it does the bag is torn or burnt open allowing all the gasses to escape.
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That was not what Kj means antisystem, it is not a measure of volume, but a measure of energy, Kilojoules
Mr. Cool, interesting formulations, but are we discussing theoretical (though true if the numbers are correct), or the practical power as an explosive, gasoline has 20-37 times the stored energy than TNT but does it show it? Propane and Butane may greate more joules but hydrogen is a much more violent and explosive combustion, although the overall energy is lower
PYRO500
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From: somewhere in florida
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-12-2001 07:07 PM
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I have an idea on how to make a garbage bag setup that will ignite and not require inflation with air amd will be simple to setup, just to check, Al + NaOH, HCL, or H2SO4 makes H2 right, just to make sure.
anyways, what if you had a jar of H2O2 in the bag too and small bucket, like the pool chlorine buckets and you weighted it down and filled the bucket with water to the top of the jar (to cool the jar so it dosent crack or the water turn to steam) and put the reactant+AL in the jar and place a jar of h2o2 30% next to it, then take a garbage bag and place it over the assembly and put bricks on either side. now take two jars, one of dilluted bleach and the other of water, or if your usning a liquid pour that in, the bleach should decompose the H2O2 and the acid/metal should make H2 and just ignite it with steel wool and a camera flash ignitor (+2 caps extra ) I might try this tonight when I get the extra cap added to my camera flash detonator
endotherm
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From: dunno
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 06-12-2001 07:49 PM
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yes they all make H2, but i find the most efficient to be Hcl and nect to that sulfuric, then Lye, be careful though, us the antistaticspray and try it with something small like a shopping bag first
mark
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posted 06-12-2001 08:03 PM
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And I thought one gallon paint cans were loud.....
ALENGOSVIG1
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From: Canada
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posted 06-12-2001 09:34 PM
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i like pressurizing the bottles better becuase they are transportable. Hydrogen and oxygen will make MUCH more sound that hydrogen and air. Propane is more powerfull than hydrogen but hydrogen is more violet and fast burning.
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Explosives Archive
nbk2000
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From: Satans asshole!
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-13-2001 12:26 AM
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I wonder what would happen if someone were to place several large bags full of hydrogen and oxygen (seperate bags) inside a big garbage bin (like behind a store), close and lock the lids, and ignite it?
Hiroshima II?
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ALENGOSVIG1
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posted 06-13-2001 01:09 AM
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or fill the bin with baloons full. that way it would be under a little pressure. might take a LONG time to fill up the baloons but it would be more effective
Mr Cool
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posted 06-13-2001 07:09 AM
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Strange, I once saw a video comparing the two fuels. 2L plastic bottles were filled, one with each fuel and oxygen in the correct proportions. They were sunk to the bottom of two large plastic bins, and set off electrically. The hydrogen/oxygen sloshed all the water around quite violently, but the propane/oxygen did this AND smashed the bin!
I suppose this is because they were in bottles though, so the pressure could build up more and more of the propane could burn before the bottle burst. I forgot that you were only doing it in bags, so yes for that purpose hydrogen might be a lot better.
PHILOU Zrealone
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From: Brussels,Belgium,Europe
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posted 06-13-2001 08:39 AM
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A three gallons trash bag full of acetylen and air (1Vol/9Vol) can destroy a brick wall!
VOD is arround 3000m/s!
As you know:
KMnO4 + H2O2 --> O2 + H2O + KMnO4+ heat
CaC2 + H2O --> CaO + C2H2 + heat
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endotherm
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From: dunno
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posted 06-13-2001 02:44 PM
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You could shoot people out of it if they didn't mine being deaf and have disfiguring burns all over their body.
And it will have sucky compression if all the bins were the same size, i doubt it would even make a bang, just flame up. It has to be from a larger chamber into a smaller chamber
For an experiment to try if you dont believe me, get two soda bottles, one with the top cut off so it's like a cup, and one that is regular, try hairspray in both of them, the cup one will just flame up , but the regular soda bottle will go ROAR and have a 6" Blue jet come from the mouth
[This message has been edited by endotherm (edited June 13, 2001).]
Anthony
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From: England
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posted 06-13-2001 06:18 PM
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Obviously if you leave the end open it'll just flame since there's no pressure build up. If you push a circle of card down to make a "projectile" or tape a sheet of paper overt he muzzle you'll get a hell of a bang. I don't know whether the bins will take the force though because it's going ot be a hell of a lot. I considered making a spudgun out of a steel 45 (55) gallon drum with like a foot diamter barrel to fire footballs. But I worked out it'd need about 2 gallons of propane and also I remembered a story about a guy who was cutting one of these drums, but it had petrol vapour in it and the blew the top off the drum and sliced his head off. So I figured they wouldn't take the pressure...
blackadder
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From: London
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posted 06-14-2001 05:51 AM
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I don't need compression, I'm just going to shoot massive flames into the air, It's gonna be real loud, that's all I'm looking for.
Also, how about hot glueing the lid to a plastic (or even metal) bin and filling with propane, butane, acetylene, etc. and igniting it the same way as with spudguns? (The two screws connected to the barbecue ignitor thing). That would ensure a big bang!!!
mark
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posted 06-14-2001 07:03 PM
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http://www.ipass.net/~shschem/C2H2experiment.htm
cutefix
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From: california
Registered: MAY 2001
posted 06-15-2001 03:02 AM
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When I was a small boy I used to play with my friends a carbide cannon.We use the empty casing of a 105mm howitzer shell or a sturdy metal pipe about 2-3 inches in diameter and 3-4 feetlong with a welded metal seal at the other end.We put in some calcium carbide granules then pour enough water to submerged the grains.There was ahole made at the side near the sealed end.Somebody blows enough air into the hole,then lit it with a taper(candle).We can make loud explosion from this effort. And continue doing so until a white stuff(lime) forms from the carbide reaction with water and no more acetylene forms.We also place an empty tin can as projectileWe were able to send the can tumbling 50 � 100 meters away depending on the quality and quantity of the explosive mixture of air and acetylene. .Another friend of mind use the acetylene tank for welding to create the same effect.It sent the can at a farther distance and created louder noise., He attached a small hose through the cannon with a sort of metal coupling.but it was very dangerous with the pure acetylene;because one of my pals almost suffocated from it while blowing the lighting hole.It was an unforgettable way to celebrate the fourth of July!
[This message has been edited by cutefix (edited June 15, 2001).]
mark
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From:
Registered: OCT 2000
posted 06-15-2001 10:09 PM
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Be warry of acetelyne devices. I filled a balloon a little bit with mapp gas and atempted to light it. I ignited my lighte 3 inches away from the fuse and the device went off! My arm is missing all of its hair now.
ANTI-SYSTEM
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From: FL. USA
Registered: JUN 2001
posted 06-16-2001 10:59 PM
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I got the supplys so i wanted to see if i got this right. i got the acid and the al foil to make some hydrogen gas. so all i got to do is put this gas in a trash bag tie er off and get some delying fuse and let it go with it lit and it should give a decent report after it has sailed off for about a minute or so. should the bag be tightly tied?
SO thats all right?
CragHack
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From:
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posted 06-17-2001 11:02 AM
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well the person who spoke of the static electricity problem was not talking out of there ass. You could be one hurting boy if the device when off next to your face.I would suggest, just like the others have, and done, to line the bag with an anti-static spray so as to CUT DOWN on the potential for static electricity. Mind you this won't reduce the risk 100%, you still migth have a mishap, but it will reduce it ALOT. I would suggest staying away from filling plastic bags with flamable gases. To dangerous if you ask me. Use paper bags, or cloth bags woven tight enough to hold gas.
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mark
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posted 06-18-2001 01:10 PM
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Isnt rubber grounded?
blackadder
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From: London
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posted 06-18-2001 01:26 PM
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mark, you're a bit confused here. Look inside a physics textbook for "static electricity", or if it's a good book, "grounding appliances".
I might be confused as well, so, um, yeah.
PYRO500
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Posts: 1513
From: somewhere in florida
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posted 06-18-2001 07:37 PM
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I'm thinking that you could make your own anti static spray for your purposes with a super saturated solution of salt and water in a spray bottle, any ideas?
mark
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From:
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posted 06-18-2001 10:10 PM
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Does anyone know a good homemade wick for hydrogen balloons?
c0deblue
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From:
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posted 06-19-2001 12:24 AM
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Some of the anti-cling/anti-wrinkle products made for use in home laundry dryers (like "Cling-Free" spray) have excellent anti-static properties and are fairly inexpensive .
Mr Cool
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posted 06-19-2001 12:49 PM
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Give the inside a quick dusting with very fine metal powder.
nbk2000
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From: Satans asshole!
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posted 06-20-2001 04:02 PM
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Shavings from a pencil lead will also work (graphite).
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goiterjoe
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posted 06-29-2001 03:16 PM
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http://www.h2go.co.uk/hydrogen.html
Ctrl_C
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posted 07-03-2001 02:17 PM
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in general, H2 and acetylene explosions dont really have all that much power, they just give the illusion of having power with such a loud sound.
and btw, i dont think graphite would work well for anti-static because grapite is very conductive. i would think that it would aid in the static arcing across the latex to the graphite.
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Posts: 164
From: dunno
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posted 06-11-2001 04:10 PM
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This never really happened, it is pure fiction but i will write about it like it's true just for ease of reading
I had like 2 gallons of Lye Drain unclogger lying around so i was bored and decided to do an old favorie trick, filled up a balloon, hooray great, little bitch bang. Then i realize it seems like it would be really hard but in actuality it is real easy to fill up a garbage bag, so i rigged it up, with a super huge display wine bottle with like 2 gallons of lye and a pound of aluminum, i ran this through a hose into a little beer bottle where it was filtered through water, in about a 2 minutes the garbage bag was clearly inflted, so i hooked up an air compressor, and filled the other 30% up with air, i attached about 4 min worth of Visco to a pack of matches and taped it on, i lit it in a field behind my house where i could see it from my window, it was about 500-600 yards away, i could just make it out from my window, then it dissapeared, just dissapeaded, no noise, no flash nothing, like a popped ballon, Well that was preety fucking gay i thought and BOOOOOOOOOOM, it startled me so much i was like shaking, it sounded like thunder, like if you were just hangin' out in your house watching TV you wouldnt just be like, what was that, you would jump out of your chair,BY far the loudest thing ive ever heard, for under like 6 bucks you could make something that would litterally shake your neighborhood... I have a new toy.....
J
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Posts: 635
From: United Kingdom
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-11-2001 05:32 PM
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Watch out for static! If I were you, I'd make sure the bag is firmly grounded before filling with either gas, but even with these precautions there is still a danger.
How much damage did it do (if any)?
J
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endotherm
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posted 06-11-2001 06:16 PM
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J- well i wouldn't really know, because i didn' really do it but if i had to make something up i would say it did no structurual damage to the ground or any surrounduings (no crater) , the biggest piece i found of garbage bag was about the size of a sheet of paper, other than some garbage bag shreds around, you wouldnt even know there was just a large explsoion, this doesn't mean that you could light them off in your room...to all those KeWLs out there,they definitley have a lot of pushing power, it doesnt have much power by VOD most likely, but definitely creates a lot of pushing pressure judging by thge sound,this thing could push and compress a large volume of gas.
i want to emphasize the sound was just really tremendous, it was like too loud, like it wasn't like some people might not notice,believe,i got my point across (whatever point that was)
and also J, I went over the inside with Supercats antistatic spray, it's funny considering i use this in my "Fake" piezo electric combustion cannon, its a paradox of some sort, using something to prevent an explosion, that i use to cause an explosion, things like that are real deep and...wait, what did i jut say, are hydrogen fumes toxic? Just Foolin'
[This message has been edited by endotherm (edited June 11, 2001).]
blackadder
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From: London
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posted 06-12-2001 12:18 PM
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Yeah, I've experimented with these things tons of times. They rule!
I used to place two wires hooked up to model rocket ignitor inside the bag. Then, I would chuck in an aerosol can with tape over the button, so aerosol can will be spraying constantly. Then the bag would be sealed, by pulling on the string things, and tying the top bit so that you get a knot in the actual bag. Then, I would wait till bag inflated to the maximum capacity, and then put the two wires to the batteries, and BANG!!!
Eventually I progressed to using propane, butane, and eventually hydrogen. I never bothered putting the air compressor in, I just left a bit of air in to start with.
Remember to tape bricks to the hydrogen binbag to prevent it from flying away, that nearly happened once.
Mr Cool
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posted 06-12-2001 01:09 PM
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Why did you progress to hydrogen? Both butane AND propane are more powerful!
Anthony
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From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-12-2001 02:02 PM
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I once filled a bin/garbage bag with hydrogen, as a step up from hydogen filled ballons which give a fairly impressive bang.
After attaching it ot the cat for a while, I release it and it didn't go bang, it just gave a gentle fireball and crashed burning in someone's garden. I think it's the pressure of hydogen in a ballon that gives the bang.
A bag full of just propane or butane can take several seconds to burn.
endotherm
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From: dunno
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posted 06-12-2001 02:34 PM
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quote:
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Originally posted by Mr Cool:
Why did you progress to hydrogen? Both butane AND propane are more powerful!
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Ummmm, where did you come up with this?
Mr Cool
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From: None of your bloody business!
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posted 06-12-2001 03:51 PM
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Hydrogen:
Equation = 2H2 + O2 --> 2H2O
You must break 2 H-H bonds and 1 O=O bond to cause a reaction. This requires a total of (397+(2*436)) = 1269 kJ
This is the amount of energy that is used up when 72 litres of hydrogen and oxygen explode (there are 3 moles of gas, each taking up 24 litres at rtp).
The reaction gives out energy by making 4 H-O bonds, each releasing 464 kJ, thus releasing a total of 1856 kJ. Subtract the energy needed to break the original bonds, and you find that: 1856 - 1269 = 587 kJ/72 L
1 litre of hydrogen and oxygen burning in an optimal ratio therefore produces 8.153 kJ of energy.
Propane:
Equation = C3H8 + 5O2 --> 3CO2 + 4H2O
You must break 2 C-C bonds, 8 C-H bonds, and 5 O=O bonds to cause a reaction. This requires a total of ((2*347)+(8*435)+(5*397)) = 6159 kJ.
This is the amount of energy needed for 144 litres of propane and oxygen.
The reaction gives out energy by making 6 C=O bonds and 8 H-O bonds. This releases a total of ((6*803)+(8*464)) = 8530 kJ. Subtracting the 6159 kJ required to break the bonds leaves 2371 kJ produced by 144 litres.
1 litre of propane and oxygen burning in an optimal ratio therefore produces 16.465 kJ of energy.
You can see that a bag full of propane and oxygen will release more than twice as much energy as an identical bag of hydogen and oxygen. Do you want me to do it for butane as well? Check them if you like, just look up the bond energies in any chemistry text book.
ANTI-SYSTEM
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From: FL. USA
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posted 06-12-2001 05:15 PM
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Your both right in a way. Hydrogen is better for this due to its higher speed of burn. butane and propane are more powerful if the way of creating more gas volume but it takes a lot longer to catchup to hydrogen. by the time it does the bag is torn or burt open allowing all the gasses to escape.
endotherm
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Posts: 164
From: dunno
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 06-12-2001 06:17 PM
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quote:
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Originally posted by ANTI-SYSTEM:
butane and propane are more powerful if the way of creating more gas volume but it takes a lot longer to catchup to hydrogen. by the time it does the bag is torn or burnt open allowing all the gasses to escape.
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That was not what Kj means antisystem, it is not a measure of volume, but a measure of energy, Kilojoules
Mr. Cool, interesting formulations, but are we discussing theoretical (though true if the numbers are correct), or the practical power as an explosive, gasoline has 20-37 times the stored energy than TNT but does it show it? Propane and Butane may greate more joules but hydrogen is a much more violent and explosive combustion, although the overall energy is lower
PYRO500
Moderator
Posts: 1513
From: somewhere in florida
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-12-2001 07:07 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I have an idea on how to make a garbage bag setup that will ignite and not require inflation with air amd will be simple to setup, just to check, Al + NaOH, HCL, or H2SO4 makes H2 right, just to make sure.
anyways, what if you had a jar of H2O2 in the bag too and small bucket, like the pool chlorine buckets and you weighted it down and filled the bucket with water to the top of the jar (to cool the jar so it dosent crack or the water turn to steam) and put the reactant+AL in the jar and place a jar of h2o2 30% next to it, then take a garbage bag and place it over the assembly and put bricks on either side. now take two jars, one of dilluted bleach and the other of water, or if your usning a liquid pour that in, the bleach should decompose the H2O2 and the acid/metal should make H2 and just ignite it with steel wool and a camera flash ignitor (+2 caps extra ) I might try this tonight when I get the extra cap added to my camera flash detonator
endotherm
Frequent Poster
Posts: 164
From: dunno
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 06-12-2001 07:49 PM
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
yes they all make H2, but i find the most efficient to be Hcl and nect to that sulfuric, then Lye, be careful though, us the antistaticspray and try it with something small like a shopping bag first
mark
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Posts: 203
From:
Registered: OCT 2000
posted 06-12-2001 08:03 PM
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And I thought one gallon paint cans were loud.....
ALENGOSVIG1
Moderator
Posts: 782
From: Canada
Registered: NOV 2000
posted 06-12-2001 09:34 PM
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i like pressurizing the bottles better becuase they are transportable. Hydrogen and oxygen will make MUCH more sound that hydrogen and air. Propane is more powerfull than hydrogen but hydrogen is more violet and fast burning.
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Explosives Archive
nbk2000
Moderator
Posts: 1235
From: Satans asshole!
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-13-2001 12:26 AM
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I wonder what would happen if someone were to place several large bags full of hydrogen and oxygen (seperate bags) inside a big garbage bin (like behind a store), close and lock the lids, and ignite it?
Hiroshima II?
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ALENGOSVIG1
Moderator
Posts: 782
From: Canada
Registered: NOV 2000
posted 06-13-2001 01:09 AM
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or fill the bin with baloons full. that way it would be under a little pressure. might take a LONG time to fill up the baloons but it would be more effective
Mr Cool
Frequent Poster
Posts: 1013
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 06-13-2001 07:09 AM
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Strange, I once saw a video comparing the two fuels. 2L plastic bottles were filled, one with each fuel and oxygen in the correct proportions. They were sunk to the bottom of two large plastic bins, and set off electrically. The hydrogen/oxygen sloshed all the water around quite violently, but the propane/oxygen did this AND smashed the bin!
I suppose this is because they were in bottles though, so the pressure could build up more and more of the propane could burn before the bottle burst. I forgot that you were only doing it in bags, so yes for that purpose hydrogen might be a lot better.
PHILOU Zrealone
Frequent Poster
Posts: 479
From: Brussels,Belgium,Europe
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-13-2001 08:39 AM
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A three gallons trash bag full of acetylen and air (1Vol/9Vol) can destroy a brick wall!
VOD is arround 3000m/s!
As you know:
KMnO4 + H2O2 --> O2 + H2O + KMnO4+ heat
CaC2 + H2O --> CaO + C2H2 + heat
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endotherm
Frequent Poster
Posts: 164
From: dunno
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 06-13-2001 02:44 PM
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You could shoot people out of it if they didn't mine being deaf and have disfiguring burns all over their body.
And it will have sucky compression if all the bins were the same size, i doubt it would even make a bang, just flame up. It has to be from a larger chamber into a smaller chamber
For an experiment to try if you dont believe me, get two soda bottles, one with the top cut off so it's like a cup, and one that is regular, try hairspray in both of them, the cup one will just flame up , but the regular soda bottle will go ROAR and have a 6" Blue jet come from the mouth
[This message has been edited by endotherm (edited June 13, 2001).]
Anthony
Moderator
Posts: 2383
From: England
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-13-2001 06:18 PM
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Obviously if you leave the end open it'll just flame since there's no pressure build up. If you push a circle of card down to make a "projectile" or tape a sheet of paper overt he muzzle you'll get a hell of a bang. I don't know whether the bins will take the force though because it's going ot be a hell of a lot. I considered making a spudgun out of a steel 45 (55) gallon drum with like a foot diamter barrel to fire footballs. But I worked out it'd need about 2 gallons of propane and also I remembered a story about a guy who was cutting one of these drums, but it had petrol vapour in it and the blew the top off the drum and sliced his head off. So I figured they wouldn't take the pressure...
blackadder
Frequent Poster
Posts: 315
From: London
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 06-14-2001 05:51 AM
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I don't need compression, I'm just going to shoot massive flames into the air, It's gonna be real loud, that's all I'm looking for.
Also, how about hot glueing the lid to a plastic (or even metal) bin and filling with propane, butane, acetylene, etc. and igniting it the same way as with spudguns? (The two screws connected to the barbecue ignitor thing). That would ensure a big bang!!!
mark
Frequent Poster
Posts: 203
From:
Registered: OCT 2000
posted 06-14-2001 07:03 PM
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http://www.ipass.net/~shschem/C2H2experiment.htm
cutefix
Frequent Poster
Posts: 330
From: california
Registered: MAY 2001
posted 06-15-2001 03:02 AM
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When I was a small boy I used to play with my friends a carbide cannon.We use the empty casing of a 105mm howitzer shell or a sturdy metal pipe about 2-3 inches in diameter and 3-4 feetlong with a welded metal seal at the other end.We put in some calcium carbide granules then pour enough water to submerged the grains.There was ahole made at the side near the sealed end.Somebody blows enough air into the hole,then lit it with a taper(candle).We can make loud explosion from this effort. And continue doing so until a white stuff(lime) forms from the carbide reaction with water and no more acetylene forms.We also place an empty tin can as projectileWe were able to send the can tumbling 50 � 100 meters away depending on the quality and quantity of the explosive mixture of air and acetylene. .Another friend of mind use the acetylene tank for welding to create the same effect.It sent the can at a farther distance and created louder noise., He attached a small hose through the cannon with a sort of metal coupling.but it was very dangerous with the pure acetylene;because one of my pals almost suffocated from it while blowing the lighting hole.It was an unforgettable way to celebrate the fourth of July!
[This message has been edited by cutefix (edited June 15, 2001).]
mark
Frequent Poster
Posts: 203
From:
Registered: OCT 2000
posted 06-15-2001 10:09 PM
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Be warry of acetelyne devices. I filled a balloon a little bit with mapp gas and atempted to light it. I ignited my lighte 3 inches away from the fuse and the device went off! My arm is missing all of its hair now.
ANTI-SYSTEM
Frequent Poster
Posts: 77
From: FL. USA
Registered: JUN 2001
posted 06-16-2001 10:59 PM
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I got the supplys so i wanted to see if i got this right. i got the acid and the al foil to make some hydrogen gas. so all i got to do is put this gas in a trash bag tie er off and get some delying fuse and let it go with it lit and it should give a decent report after it has sailed off for about a minute or so. should the bag be tightly tied?
SO thats all right?
CragHack
Frequent Poster
Posts: 627
From:
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 06-17-2001 11:02 AM
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well the person who spoke of the static electricity problem was not talking out of there ass. You could be one hurting boy if the device when off next to your face.I would suggest, just like the others have, and done, to line the bag with an anti-static spray so as to CUT DOWN on the potential for static electricity. Mind you this won't reduce the risk 100%, you still migth have a mishap, but it will reduce it ALOT. I would suggest staying away from filling plastic bags with flamable gases. To dangerous if you ask me. Use paper bags, or cloth bags woven tight enough to hold gas.
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mark
Frequent Poster
Posts: 203
From:
Registered: OCT 2000
posted 06-18-2001 01:10 PM
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Isnt rubber grounded?
blackadder
Frequent Poster
Posts: 315
From: London
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 06-18-2001 01:26 PM
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mark, you're a bit confused here. Look inside a physics textbook for "static electricity", or if it's a good book, "grounding appliances".
I might be confused as well, so, um, yeah.
PYRO500
Moderator
Posts: 1513
From: somewhere in florida
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-18-2001 07:37 PM
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I'm thinking that you could make your own anti static spray for your purposes with a super saturated solution of salt and water in a spray bottle, any ideas?
mark
Frequent Poster
Posts: 203
From:
Registered: OCT 2000
posted 06-18-2001 10:10 PM
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Does anyone know a good homemade wick for hydrogen balloons?
c0deblue
Frequent Poster
Posts: 229
From:
Registered: JAN 2001
posted 06-19-2001 12:24 AM
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Some of the anti-cling/anti-wrinkle products made for use in home laundry dryers (like "Cling-Free" spray) have excellent anti-static properties and are fairly inexpensive .
Mr Cool
Frequent Poster
Posts: 1013
From: None of your bloody business!
Registered: DEC 2000
posted 06-19-2001 12:49 PM
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Give the inside a quick dusting with very fine metal powder.
nbk2000
Moderator
Posts: 1235
From: Satans asshole!
Registered: SEP 2000
posted 06-20-2001 04:02 PM
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Shavings from a pencil lead will also work (graphite).
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goiterjoe
New Member
Posts: 10
From:
Registered: JUN 2001
posted 06-29-2001 03:16 PM
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http://www.h2go.co.uk/hydrogen.html
Ctrl_C
Frequent Poster
Posts: 253
From:
Registered: NOV 2000
posted 07-03-2001 02:17 PM
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in general, H2 and acetylene explosions dont really have all that much power, they just give the illusion of having power with such a loud sound.
and btw, i dont think graphite would work well for anti-static because grapite is very conductive. i would think that it would aid in the static arcing across the latex to the graphite.