Talk:Card Slinger (5e Class)

I hope you like my Card Slinger

How the Dealer Works

How the Dealer Works for the Card Slinger

1) Both the player and the character have a deck of cards. The players deck of cards mimics the characters deck. The player must shuffle and draw a card to see which card the character draws.

2) Shuffling is a bonus action.

3) Drawing is a action.

4) Charging is a bonus action.

5) Shuffling & drawing cause it to charge. Throwing is well to get rid of it since the Card Slinger is now holding a bomb.

6) At level 1 the Card Slinger can throw the card up to 40 feet. At level 3 the Card Slinger can throw it up to 50 feet.

7) All creatures caught in the blast must make a Dex Save Throw to take half damage from the blast.

8) The Charging it a build of energy in the card before it explodes. It charges until next Card Slingers turn. Pretty much think of this way you have a grenade you pull the pin (Shuffle and Drawing) and then you throw the grenade and then it explodes a moment later.

9) The Card Slinger shuffles (free action) the deck and then draws (action) the top card, the card is now charging. Now the Card Slinger can throw the card (free action) (you do not need to throw the card but you are now holding a live bomb that will go off your next turn).

10) The charging is pretty much away to get away from the blast zone. This delay also allows the player to use the card in ways to slide the card into places to blast it open.

Spelling and grammar

I need help with the Spelling and grammar I dyslexic.

May I have free reign on this? Please look at some contribs of mine and know I don't take away flavor. This design is interesting and I'd keep intact everything to my best ability. It sounds scary, but I do my best to work with primary contributors not against. I'll wait a week in the event of business or no response then dive into this. BigShotFancyMan (talk) 14:23, 19 November 2017 (MST)

I've done quite a bit of rework and like where the core class is. I'll be starting on subclasses soon. BigShotFancyMan (talk) 13:12, 11 December 2017 (MST)

I'm done with this except for wikifying it. During my time I thought to myself I think this should just be a subclass and then today (after 2-3 solid days) I find someone has a cardslinger subclass :D :D :D. Anyways, I am pretty satisfied with this class. Needs flavor text for the features and wikified but I'm ready for feedback. BigShotFancyMan (talk) 13:50, 12 December 2017 (MST)

Sure knock yourself out.

Free Action

Your wrong in the PHB page 190

Other Activity on Your Turn

Your turn can include a variety of flourishes that require neither your action nor your move. You can communicate however you are able, through brief utterances and gestures, as you take your turn. You can also interact with one object or feature of the environment for free, during either your move or your action. For example, you could open a door during your move as you stride toward a foe, or you could draw your weapon as part o f the same action you use to attack. If you want to interact with a second object, you need to use your action. Some magic items and other special objects always require an action to use, as stated in their descriptions. The DM might require you to use an action for any of these activities w hen it needs special care or when it presents an unusual obstacle. For instance, the DM could reasonably expect you to use an action to open a stuck door or turn a crank to lower a drawbridge.

While yes, Free Actions are explained, no they do not exist. Your more likely to use bonus actions or actions, unless you're adamant about the free action, then include the "free action" as part of movement (like mentioned above) or as part of an attack (drawing a weapon when you attack). Free actions don't exactly function in 5e, they're just things that happen as part of other actions/movement. Is that helpful? BigShotFancyMan (talk) 13:40, 19 November 2017 (MST)

Okay I thought bonus action and free actions were the same thing

Recent Edits

Rosewater, can you please explain why you insist on changing the Stone Faced feature? Or why you are removing things I specifically placed to avoid unbalanced results? BigShotFancyMan (talk) 23:53, 19 April 2018 (MDT)

I don't think it is unbalance I tested it out before your changes and worked better then I hoped. I think stone face works better as an advantage.

On the contrary. Allowing the effect of the suit to apply on cantrips makes it unbalanced. What makes the advantage "work" better? Gaining advantage on skills is rather boring. The alternative that I used follows core classes. BigShotFancyMan (talk) 09:59, 20 April 2018 (MDT)

Hey Rosewater, I am still waiting to hear why advantage works better. Might I suggest instead of changing half the work someone has done you try discussing things?
Action Surge and Extra Attack are unnecessary features. 4 attacks for this class with the highest damage is 5d10 or roughly 30 damage. This is also area of effect damage. 120 damage to possibly more than one target is much stronger than anything in the Player's Handbook in terms of attacks. Spells have the potential but they're limited to slots. In addition, the status condition's that accompany the attacks. Apply the Action Surge, it just gets more out of hand. Second, or third?, why the unconventional starting gold? BigShotFancyMan (talk) 07:04, 1 May 2018 (MDT)

I could easily say that's how I want it as the creator of the class but I not going say that since it sounds childish and the fact you sat down and wrote me thank you for that. If I would known that you would of taken control of my class where you over ride my changes I would never said okay to you making changes at all.

1) Before I had it as You get a proficiency in the skill and if you already had it you got double proficiency. To my knowledge is not a thing. I made this char early on in playing 5e and was unaware of advantage and disadvantage at that time. So I changed it to fit the rules of the the game more.

2) I disagree with that. your looking at the end game when this char is high level yes it going be a powerhouse but not in the beginning. In the beginning he not pulling four cards in fact they only get action Surge which they can only use once between rest.

This class is suppose to be about speed A card slinger throws cards a skilled card play can deal cards very quickly. Thematically having the card slinger able to speed up the speed he can pulls and throw cards makes more sense. Also each card has a different damage value so while you can pull four of the same card the odd are very low.

3) why 1d30 I find it more fun. I mean at most it give 300 gold but that not to much to start with. Also with online dice roller using a 1d30 is not a issue.

Well, thanks for answering my questions at least. I suppose we aren't going to see eye to eye on things. I'm going to ask for some second opinions, get some help from others, and maybe come to a solution that works best for everyone. BigShotFancyMan (talk) 09:50, 1 May 2018 (MDT)

From who?

Hey, Nomadic Inferno here. I disagree with the max 120 average damage being OP. One, there’s a really, really low chance of getting it. I mean seriously, drawing exactly the right cards 4 times in a row? Such an insanely low chance. I did the math, and without using any of the very limited abilities that let you choose your card, the chances are 1 in 674 of getting max damage on all of them. 2, meteor swarm. 140 average in 4 seperate areas with a radius of 40 each. More damage, and more area. Spells have slots, this has a 1 in 674 chance of occurring. I would suggest 1d20x10 starting gold though. Or maybe 6d4x10. Even with the reduction it’s more than any other class. I really like Card Slinger though

Question

when you play this class do you need an actual deck of cards--Alucarddragonborn (talk) 10:50, 2 May 2018 (MDT)

You could use construction paper in 4 different colors and write what you need on them, and draw them from a hat. You can even use regular lined paper, tear into pieces, write 2H for 2 of hearts and go on like that. A deck may be easiest but certainly don't let it restrict you. BigShotFancyMan (talk) 10:54, 2 May 2018 (MDT)

that cool i ask because some people might not have a deck of cards.also if there isnt already how about a feature that you could do card tricks that can attract a crowd of people allowing a fellow party member for some good old pick pocketing.--Alucarddragonborn (talk) 12:33, 2 May 2018 (MDT)

that is a feasible thing to do via roleplay and not necessary for a feature. BigShotFancyMan (talk) 12:42, 2 May 2018 (MDT)

You could do that with a Performance check

There seems to be an issue if you draw and throw either a 2 or 3 before lvl 6. As the class is written at the moment you can only throw a card 30ft before lvl 6 meaning you are guaranteed to be in the blast radius when you throw a 2 or 3. Also, a 60ft radius on a 2 means that it is possible for 75 creatures to be in the blast radius assuming each creature is in its own 5ft square. If this had been the case in the situation I was in in my last session, I rolled a 6 for damage and have a charisma modifier of +4, I would have dealt 750 damage with a single attack action at lvl 2 with no magic items or buffs of any kind. And yes, I almost TPK the party...TheFuzzyGoblinWizard (talk)

With regards to my above post and giving it some more thought, you can look at each individual Card as a cantrip spell with a bit of wild magic causing the variance in them. With this in mind, I propose the following adjustments:

For the 2 Card, decrease radius from 60ft to 20ft. A well placed throw into a crowd could still hit 41 people and you are not guaranteed to hit yourself with you own attack even when you roll an natural 20 at lvls 5 and lower.

For the 3 Card, decrease radius from 40ft to 15ft. You can still catch 25 people with this if they are bunched together in perfect formation and this brings it into line with the change to the 2 Card.

For the 4 Card, decrease radius from 20ft to 10ft. This is to bring this Card in line with the above changes as well as reign in this AOE "Eldritch Blast".

For the 5 Card, decrease the length of the line for 60ft to 45ft. Although you cannot kill youself with this one (unless you roll poorly and the DM is feeling vindictive), being able to hit every enemy that is between 30ft and 90ft away at lvl 1 seems a little strong to me.

For the 6 Card, decrease the length of the line for 40ft to 30ft. This change is primarily to bring this Card in line with the above change. Should still be easy to catch 2 creatures with this.

For the 7 Card, decrease the length of the line for 20ft to 15ft. This change is primarily to bring this Card in line with the above changes. Still possible to catch 2 creatures with a good roll and proper positioning with this short range "Eldritch Blast".

I'd be happy to hear anyone's opinions on these changes as well as other ideas any one has, cheers. TheFuzzyGoblinWizard (talk) 08:13, 1 August 2018 (MDT)

I calculated the enemies affected for the radius attacks using the following: N= the radius/5ft aka the number of unique squares affected. Creatures affected = ((n(n+1)/2)*4)+1. The (n(n+1)/2) portion gives us 1 of 4 quadrants that makes up the whole area. *4 gives us the total area of spaces other than the origin of the "explosion" and the +1 includes the origin space. --TheFuzzyGoblinWizard (talk) 08:34, 2 August 2018 (MDT)

I believe the reduction in the aoe's of the cards is a good step in the right direction, but the class has some pretty glaring other issues. The other pretty major issues with the cards/class is the fact that the cards deal aoe damage and you can't save against it to negate or reduce the damage dealt(in comparison, magic missile is a first level spell and you get a better version of it in an aoe that scales to absurd levels), plus the extra attacks/action surge allows you deal damage akin to that of a fighter against multiple creatures, making the class completely outshine any other class in terms of total damage output which can't be avoided(also, as written, you don't even need to hit a creature to deal damage to it, you just need to throw the card at the ground/near it to damage it since the cards deal aoe damage). As a whole, it looks like The Deck feature needs to be reworked and/or the class needs to make significantly less attacks.--Blobby383b (talk) 12:09, 2 August 2018 (MDT)

Great mention of the action surge/extra attack + AOE damage. I already wanted to remove those from the class entirely when I began working on my variant of this, and your comment helps ensure I don't forget to do it. BigShotFancyMan (talk) 12:36, 2 August 2018 (MDT)

Yeah, attacking 3+ times a turn is wayyyyyy too good and I agree they should be removed if not heavily altered. Also just wanted to point out that I messed up when I calculated my initial AOE in my I game incident. I hit 313 5ft squares meaning a theoretical max damage of 3130. Thats more DBZ than D&D--TheFuzzyGoblinWizard (talk) 12:58, 2 August 2018 (MDT)

So what is the point of rolling to attack? Why would you want advantage? So far I've been playing it so that if I want to "stick" the card to a specific target I roll against their AC but other than that I don't really get it. Also, Do you save with Dex or Con? Does detect magic find anything about the cards? Do they not work in an anti-magic field? How does the actual attack work? I've been playing it as Drawing and throwing is an action and I can charge the card as a bonus action so it goes off that turn, otherwise it blows on my next. I guess I'm confused because it says drawing is an action. Could someone please edit this to explain these things in a way that is balanced for the game? Daedalus (talk) 03:47, 3 October 2018 (PST)