Ultimate Marvel/Headscratchers

• At this point, is anyone in S.H.I.E.L.D. left ALIVE? Talk about a redshirt army. They die more easily then a vampire in a pencil factory explosion. And God only knows what the deal is with Nick Fury at the moment.
• Beast. "Oh my God, a bunch of stones fell on him, now he's dead." Much later. "He was only slightly squashed. Everyone be happy now."
  • And the EXACT SAME THING had happened to him ALREADY.
• At one point in the ULTIMATES, Captain America is suspected of murdering innocent civilians. Fine. So to arrest him, S.H.I.E.L.D. blows up half a WW 2 cemetery. Not only that, they surprise and kidnap a WW 2 veteran! Guess heart attacks just don't happen in the Ultimate Universe.
  • Not that I really want to defend this stuff, but I feel I need to point something out: if Captain America went on a killing spree, I would say the life of a WWII vet is worth putting him down.
    • Fuck you.
    • He's right though, I mean, Captain America is one of the strongest guys around, so I'm sure one old man is more than worth it to bring him down.
      • While such reasoning is entirely in-character for Ultimate Nick Fury, given that he is an absolutely callous sonofabitch, I think the point that people were making was that alleged law enforcement personnel started a fight in the presence of innocent bystanders when they didn't strictly need to. Simply calling Ult Cap on his phone and asking him to report in would have one of two results: either Cap would obligingly walk right into the ambush, or else he'd take off running. Either one gets him the hell out of the park first and since they've already moved their troops into position they can just hit him on the move.
• Okay, so after the Liberators' attack on America was crushed, Captain America told Nick Fury the Ultimates were quitting government sponsorship and becoming an independent superteam because they're presence abroad was the cause of the invasion in the first place. Setting aside the not-even-barely-concealed left-wing propaganda throughout the whole Liberators story arc, how is that even possible? For one thing, most of their technology and resources are SHIELD property. I could arguably see Tony Stark going independent since he built the Iron Man suit on his own, but how does Captain America get away with it? Once he quits government sponsorship, shouldn't he be immediately arrested as a non-sanctioned genetic mutation?
  • It's CAPTAIN AMERICA. The guy's a national icon despite his jerkass tendencies, and he and his team just saved everybody's hides from a group who wanted nothing less than to destroy the USA. All told, I'm sure the higher-ups would figure it acceptable to let them off the hook.

• Captain America's wildly fluctuating power level bugs me. In the "Ultimate Extinction" arc, Cap jumps out of a SHIELD heli-carrier from who knows how high in the air (but it had to be higher than the tallest building in New York) and freefalls straight down to slam shield-first into the herald of Galactus, with no apparent injury to himself. Even disregarding the obvious physics problem here, how do they square this with earlier and later stories where Cap doesn't demonstrate nearly this level of power? For instance, in the "Ultimate Six" arc where six of Spider-Man's villains attack the White House, Captain America briefly wrestles with Ultimate Spider-Man and they seem to be evenly matched.
  • 616 Captain America has at least once survived a 10,000+ foot fall from an airplane... by making sure that his shield hit the ground first and absorbed all the impact. Never mind that this makes no sense by the laws of physics as we know them, this is comic books, and there is precedent.
  • It doesn't really matter how high he falls from once he's high enough to reach terminal velocity. And there are records of normal humans surviving falls at that speed under certain conditions; it's not impossible to imagine that a just-barely-superhuman could manage that.
  • Well, Ultimate Spiderman can throw cars at people. Wrestling him evenly is a much greater feat than just jumping out of a chopper and not die...
    • Granted, but Cap has got to be at least twice Spider-Man's size and weight. Proportionate spider-strength or not, Cap should still be able to overpower him.
    • He could throw him around, but he couldn't do any real damage if Spidey were serious.
    • Correct me if I'm wrong but this version of Spider-man hasn't matured yet so he isn't nowhere near as strong as the original. He did hurt his hands punching Kingpin who didn't even flinch. Also, Cap knocked out the Hulk in their first meating.
  • Captain America's shield is made of a vibranium-adamantium alloy. Adamantium is Wolverine's "cuts through anything metal", and vibranium has the special property that it cancels out all vibrations of any kind, making it completely bulletproof, soundproof and impact-proof. So it's not that Cap himself is invulnerable, but his shield is; the "jumping from a high distance only to land unharmed by having the shield absorb the impact" is kind of a schtick of his.
    • The problem is that while the shield is perfectly invulnerable, it still decelerates from terminal velocity to zero as soon as it hits the ground... and so would Cap, as he lands right on top of it. He should thus feel the effects of slamming into an invulnerable patch of ground at terminal velocity. And the shield can't magically absorb all momentum directed into it (especially not coming from the side facing Cap) or else he wouldn't be able to move it, let alone throw it. The only way this works is if the shield has the ability to generate an inertialess field, selectively, under Cap's conscious control. IOW, it doesn't remotely work at all without writer's fiat.
      • That's basically how it works, in every incarnation of Captain America, the shield only absorbs momentum when you want it to and/or when the plot says so. I don't think it's ever been explained how this happens, they just Hand Wave it by mentioning vibranium.
  • It's canon that Ultimate Cap's shield can absorb falling damage like nothing. In The Ultimates first issue, Bucky states that Captain America always jumps from planes without parachutes, because these "are for wussies".
• Nick Fury's initial claim that Spider-Man will belong to him upon reaching the age of 18 always disturbed me. He did muddle it enough to make it plausible that Peter would think imprisonment was imminent. This is stinkin' Nick Fury, the guy who basically runs the world, right? He should be eloquent enough to just outright say Peter will be an Ultimate the first time without any misunderstanding.
  • He should be eloquent enough to do that, but unfortunately Ultimate Nick Fury is an arrogant ass-faced moron. He's so wrapped up in his own superiority complex that he thinks he can intimidate anyone he meets into submission by crushing them under the weight of his massive ego. He said "when you turn 18 you belong to me" rather than "when you turn 18 you'll be on my team" because his pathological superiority complex won't allow him to do anything else.
  • He was being written by Brian Bendis. Bendis's characters could take six pages to stutter out what kind of breakfast cereal they're planning to eat that morning, and you still wouldn't be sure whether they want milk in it or not.
• Putting aside the two year delay, irritating Star Trek references, inability to go two pages without a flashback and constantly rehashing the story from slightly different perspectives - Ultimate Hulk vs. Wolverine occupies a position that makes no real sense in continuity. At the end, Nick Fury is supposedly experimenting on Betty Ross to find out what she did to herself (which in itself makes no sense as the modified Hulk serum was made by Jennifer Walters, not Betty - who isn't even a scientist in the Ultimate continuity and hell, she's in the Ultimates PR department when the comics start and here, she seems to be in management). Yet, she shows no abilities in the finale of Ultimates 2 and seems to be surprised that Bruce is alive. Not to mention that both the end of Ultimates 2 and Ultimate Wolverine vs. Hulk establish Banner having gained some control over the Hulk... which is pretty much ignored by the Ultimate Hulk Annual.
• How about everything pertaining to the backstory of the new Red Skull? Even for a comic book, there's so much medical, military, and logical fail in this that it's headache inducing.
  • Take special note of the total idiocy of the reason he's the Red Skull. HE CUT HIS FACE OFF - even for a deranged psychotic mass murderer, that's crazy and stupid and above all - IDIOTIC.
  • This Troper is just agape at the fact that for once, a comic-book military super-soldier project raising a child from birth actually seemed to remember to treat the kid at relatively decently, make sure he had psychological counselling available, and not use cattle prods -- and their test subject goes completely psychotic and kills off the entire project team anyway. Seriously. What's the point of even trying?
    • It occurs to me that that may have been the entire point. Maybe they were alluding to the whole "superior ability breeds superior ambition" thing from Star Trek.
    • In a superhero comic book? The mind boggles.

• Ultimate Comics: Avengers is certainly an improvement over the disastrous Ultimates 3 but... we're supposed to buy that Tony Stark had a brother who is - according to Nick Fury - ten times smarter and totally amoral but no one ever mentioned him before and apparently the reason Nick Fury didn't use him before is because... he's amoral. Not generally an issue that Nick Fury would have. Not to mention the fact that he's apparently created an entirely controllable version of the Hulk in his spare time. You'd think that someone smarter than Tony Stark and without the imminent threat of an inoperable brain tumour, total lack of responsibility and rampant alcoholism might be useful when you're say... fighting the Skrull or Galactus or an invasion of the continental USA.
  • Hell, Fury should probably consider amorality a perk, considering some of his own actions. For that matter, I don't buy the supposed reason that Starkbro was never in the country (and, thus, somehow, we've never heard of him). If he is completely amoral, what the hell would a "gentlemen's agreement" matter to him? He'd break it for profits just to show up baby brother like he's so enjoying doing now.
    • To be honest the guy is clearly a genius but also....he's clearly an idiot at the same time. I mean if he's ten times smarter then how the hell did Tony Stark buy out his company under him? And even more when the **** did this super genius think it was a good idea to combine Bruce Banner and The Hulk. Oh sure I mean it sure sounds like a genius bruiser was in the works but I guess Mr. Genius forgot that Bruce is a freaking wuss. I guess big brother Stark has a ten in book smarts and a three in common sense while Tony suddenly looks more well rounded.

• For all the technological advances the Baxter Building has, they didn't have a 'turn shield on when huge mass is heading for us' sensor package. What?
  • You'll have to be more specific. Has that oversight actually been an issue? If so, when?

• The big reveal in Ultimate Origins that mutants were all the product of trying to recreate the super soldier serum. Even in the crazy world of comic book explanations that are full of Fridge Logic and truck-sized plot holes, they never bother to explain how the government managed to disseminate the super soldier serum to every existing mutant across the globe in the Ultimate Universe.
  • IT went airborne... I think... i could be wrong.
  • The government never did anything. Apparently, the mutation started spreading by itself for some reason.

• After all my favorite characters die in Ultimatum, the three remaining X-men I like disappear off the face of the earth. What happened to Rouge? Or Iceman? Them still being teenagers and known mutants would have been interesting. And then theres Colossus the one I would have loved to see develop more but was reduced to brute rolls in later arcs should have at least gotten a mention in a series that is focusing on Wolverine's son, And with Nightcrawler and Jean-Paul both dying in Ultimatum I would have very much enjoyed seeing him cope and grow as a character and see how he will work without Banshee but they decide to make Kate or should I say Jean the new leader to the new team of mutants. I would at least like to see Kitty back on a team... How could they not want to fix up the loose ends about all these charcters before they go and rebuild expies of the old team?
  • Iceman lives with the Parkers now (as does the Human Torch). As for the rest of your argument, I can't disagree. There's quite a bit that needs to be answered.
  • According to Ultimate X #5, Colossus and Storm are being held in a lab somewhere, and according to Ultimate Fallout #2, Rogue is on the run. Something tells me these things will be dealt with in the new Ultimate X Men stuff.

• The reveal in New Ultimates vs Ultimate Avengers that there was a Hulk before Bruce Banner, whose serum is actually a pill that turns you into a Hulk that has normal skin color, retains your intelligence and personality, and only lasts 24 hours, while still allowing for transformations between human and hulk. Oh yeah, and this version was actually completed before the "original" Hulk's. And no one during the whole Super Soldier race thought that this might be their best option, or at least a good enough one to stop experimenting with other powers? It solves all of the major issues, including the fact that anyone who went AWOL would now be a liability with powers.
• Did the Brits really not see any value in the ability to make people like the Leader? Sure, he's not a super soldier, and he can't walk, but super-intelligence does sound handy.
• What is the deal with Swarm? In Ultimates 2, she's a Syrian mutant who can control insects who gets stomped on by Wasp/Janet Pym. Fine. But then in Ultimate Comics: Avengers, she's a blond-haired blue-eyed Georgian woman with a Rape as Drama backstory and now has Janet's powers. And is somehow magically brought back from being squashed. How can you completely revive someone who's been crushed into a puddle of blood and hair, with all their memories intact? Also, an important part of the character, at least in Avengers, is that she never takes off her wedding ring in remembrance of her late husband. Look back at Swarm in Ultimates 2, however, and it's not there. Can anyone clear this up? It's doing my head in. .
  • All the ultimate avengers scripts were adapted from ideas mark millar had for the main ultimates series. Some of these ideas might have been quite old, or just not implemented for a very good reason. It's possible the scripts weren't updated to keep up with the events that the marvel universe had since experienced
• Spider-Man gets shot by one of Fury's people, and it's Carol Danvers' fault, even thought she was in a coma at the time. Not only does she have to step down from her job as Director of SHIELD, it's handed back to Nick Fury, who last fucked up so bad they had to deport him to another dimension. Fury, who once had the US invaded on his watch. Fury, who failed to detect Gregory Stark plotting to meddle in the affairs of other countries.
  • Well, this is Ultimate Nick Fury we're talking about here. If politicians make a decision to his benefit that makes you wonder exactly how many pictures Fury has of them in bed with a dead girl and a live boy, the answer is likely "all the pictures". Sure, only monstrous levels of corruption and/or subversion of the democratic process can explain this crap. It's just, its entirely in-character for Ult Fury to be monstrously corrupt and subversive, so...
• The banshee drug from the last few issues of ultimate x-men. It gives normal people super-powers, it makes people that already have powers almost godlike (turning cyclops into a superman knock-off), has existed for at least twenty years, it's cheap and widely available and has no side-effects if used in proper amounts. This exists in the universe where the entire premise is there not being a good super-power serum yet. It invalidates the origin of roughly every single character in the entire universe. Why would SHIELD fund any superhuman research if this already exists? Why would companies like Oscorp or Roxxon think there is any money in a super-soldier drug if it already exists? Why would the world hate and fear mutants if they emerged at the exact same time as a drug that gave you the exact same advantages as them?